XPost: alt.bible, alt.religion.christian.biblestudy, alt.religion.christianity   
   XPost: alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic   
   From: none@none.con   
      
   On Jun 22, 2023, James wrote   
   (in article<8fh89ihkk6cvni5dhr2gp0q09p1cug9i46@4ax.com>):   
      
   > On Mon, 19 Jun 2023 15:31:24 -0700, No one  wrote:   
   >   
   > > On Jun 19, 2023, James wrote   
   > > (in article):   
   > >   
   > > > On Sun, 18 Jun 2023 12:13:14 -0700, No one  wrote:   
   > > >   
   > > > > On Jun 18, 2023, James wrote   
   > > > > (in article):   
   > > > >   
   > > > > > The 3 wisemen visited the baby Jesus?   
   > > > >   
   > > > > The Visit of the Wise Men   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2: 1NOW WHEN Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of   
   Herod   
   > > > > the king, behold, wise men [astrologers] from the east came to   
   Jerusalem,   
   > > > > asking,   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:2 Where is He Who has been born King of the Jews? For we have   
   seen   
   > > > > His   
   > > > > star in the east at its rising and have come to worship Him. [Num   
   24:17;   
   > > > > Jer   
   > > > > 23:5; Zec 9:9]   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:3 When Herod the king heard this, he was disturbedand troubled,   
   and   
   > > > > the   
   > > > > whole of Jerusalem with him.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:4 So he called together all the chief priests and learned men   
   > > > > (scribes)   
   > > > > of the people and anxiously asked them where the Christ was to be born.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:5 They replied to him, In Bethlehem of Judea, for so it is   
   written   
   > > > > by   
   > > > > the prophet:   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:6 And you Bethlehem, in the land of Judah, you are not in any way   
   > > > > least   
   > > > > or insignificant among the chief cities of Judah; for from you shall   
   come   
   > > > > a   
   > > > > Ruler (Leader) Who will govern and shepherd My people Israel. [Mic 5:2]   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:7 Then Herod sent for the wise men [astrologers] secretly, and   
   > > > > accurately to the last point ascertained from them the time of the   
   > > > > appearing   
   > > > > of the star [that is, how long the star had made itself visible since   
   its   
   > > > > rising in the east].   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:8 Then he sent them to Bethlehem, saying, Go and search for the   
   > > > > Child   
   > > > > carefully and diligently, and when you have found Him, bring me word,   
   > > > > that I   
   > > > > too may come and worship Him.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:9 When they had listened to the king, they went their way, and   
   > > > > behold,   
   > > > > the star which had been seen in the east in its rising went before them   
   > > > > until   
   > > > > it came and stood over the place where the young Child was.   
   >   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:10 When they saw the star, they were thrilled with ecstatic joy.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:11 And on going into the house, they saw the Child with Mary His   
   > > > > mother, and they fell down and worshiped Him. Then opening their   
   treasure   
   > > > > bags, they presented to Him gifts--gold and frankincense and myrrh.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Mat 2:12 And receiving an answer to their asking, they were divinely   
   > > > > instructed and warned in a dream not to go back to Herod; so they   
   departed   
   > > > > to   
   > > > > their own country by a different way.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Notice, they were looking for the "Messiah" and all of Jerusalem was a   
   > > > > buzz   
   > > > > about these things. Do you really feel they left, as pagans?   
   >   
   > Yes, they were astrologers, thus pagans.   
      
   “And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars;   
   and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the   
   waves roaring;” (Luk 21:25)   
      
   Well?   
   >   
   >   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Now then, being as you say you believe ALL the Bible, do you now   
   believe   
   > > > > that   
   > > > > Jesus is the Christ?   
   > > >   
   > > > 1 + 1 = 2. I never doubted it. Jesus is the Son of God, and the   
   > > > Messiah, the Christ.   
   > >   
   > > If that is the case then 5-10 years ago you were lying to everyone since   
   you   
   > > and the JW's were utterly opposed to Jesus denying both his deity and   
   > > divinity.   
   >   
   > We defined him just as the Bible does. He is God's Son. (John 10:36)   
      
   And for that reason the Jews sought to kill him for claiming he was God.   
   >   
   >   
   > > Even as I recall denying that Jesus rose from the dead.   
   >   
   > Your recall is all wrong. The resurrection of Jesus was and is, a main   
   > tenet of JW doctrines.   
      
   Since when? It was not always that way.   
   >   
   >   
   > > >   
   > > >   
   > > > > God on earth a foretold and celebrated by all the   
   > > > > Heavenly Hosts on his Birth Day?   
   > > >   
   > > > Jesus was never Jehovah. They are two separate people each with his   
   > > > own will:   
   > >   
   > > Jesus was always Jehovah, Yahweh.   
   >   
   > Then why does Jesus call him "my God".John 20:17,   
   >   
   > "..., ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and   
   > your God.""   
      
   Because His Father is His God. Is that so difficult?   
   >   
   >   
   > >   
   > > Did Jesus lie about being creator?   
   >   
   > After Jesus was created (Col 1:15), He assisted God with the rest of   
   > creation.   
      
   “Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:”   
   (Col 1:15)   
      
   You see there? For the 5th time this year I have had to correct you. It does   
   not state that.   
      
   Jesus came down from heaven, from eternity past. And the Glory he had before   
   he came was restored to him in front of the disciples.   
      
   >   
   >   
   > > Did he lie about speaking to Abraham?   
   >   
   > What Scripture is that?   
   >   
   > At any rate, Jesus existed as a spirit being in Heaven and known as   
   > the WORD before humans were created.   
      
   And he created them, in "our" Image. He was fully part or the Godhead.   
   >   
   >   
   > >   
   > > Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the   
   > > glory which I had with thee before the world was.   
   > >   
   > > Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with   
   me   
   > > where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for   
   > > thou   
   > > lovedst me before the foundation of the world.   
   > >   
   > > “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.   
   > > Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast   
   thou   
   > > seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before   
   > > Abraham was, I am. Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid   
   > > himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and   
   so   
   > > passed by.” (Joh 8:56-59)   
      
   These scriptures spoke of what I stated above and not denied by you.   
   > >   
   > >   
   > > >   
   > > >   
   > > > -- New King James   
   > > > Luke 22:42 saying, "Father, if it is Your will, remove this cup from   
   > > > Me; nevertheless not My will, but Yours, be done.''   
   > > >   
   > > > Rejoice, you are learning Bible truths.   
   > >   
   > > You are copying scripture that I have been pointing out to you that you   
   have   
   > > yet to understand.   
   > >   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)