XPost: talk.religion.buddhism, alt.zen, alt.philosophy.zen   
   XPost: alt.buddha.short.fat.guy   
   From: evelyn.ruut@gmail.com   
      
   "oxtail"  wrote in message   
   news:i496m9$nbc$3@news.eternal-september.org...   
   > Evelyn wrote:   
   >   
   >> "Evelyn"  wrote in message   
   >>> "Julian"  wrote in message   
   >>>> On 15/08/2010 16:08, Tang Huyen wrote:   
   >>>>> Evelyn wrote:   
   >>>>>> "Julian"   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> As for myself, I have only ever "chanted for" something once in my   
   >>>>>>> life and far from involving anything magic/occult it was a purely   
   >>>>>>> mundane transaction. In order to obtain a Gohonzon I had to   
   >>>>>>> demonstrate   
   >>>>>>> mastery of the Gongyo ceremony.  There was nothing whatsoever   
   >>>>>>> magical or occult in my performance of the ceremony merely the   
   >>>>>>> result of the long   
   >>>>>>> and painful austerity of the assiduous practice that was (for me)   
   >>>>>>> required   
   >>>>>>> to master it. Just bloody hard work (and sore knees.)   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> And you make fun of tibetan buddhism?   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Julian can speak for himself, but from my side, I can see the humour   
   >>>>> of what he says. He says that he goes through the motion without any   
   >>>>> faith in it. Just the bare motions, devoid of any supernatural   
   >>>>> superstructure to infuse meaning into them. Like many Christian   
   >>>>> priests and ministers who have lost faith. The part:<>>>> involving anything magic/occult it was a purely mundane transaction>>   
   >>>>>  is very poignant. Also:<>.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> It is also very poignant that you miss his humour.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Now just imagine a follower of the Tibetan religion going though the   
   >>>>> Tantric motions day after day in such spirit ...   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Went through the motion, not "goes."   
   >>>> Once I received the Gohonzon it was "game over!"  :)   
   >>>   
   >>>   
   >>> Ah then you had possession of the  "preccciooussssss........."   
   >>   
   >>   
   >> Am I the only one who thinks it is pretty weird to FAKE a practice meant   
   >> to be taken sincerely, in order to GET an object?   
   >   
   >   
   > It's never weird for human beings   
   > to pray to the unknown god   
   > in whatever mode and for whatever purpose.   
   > That's just one way of   
   > being humble spirituality.   
   >   
   > --   
   > Oxtail is not doing what he thinks he is doing here.   
      
      
   You are more forgiving of such things, than I am Oxtail.   I think it is   
   insincere, and as such a lie.   
      
   --   
   Best Regards,   
   Evelyn   
      
   In the stony fastness of the mountains there is a strange market, where one   
   may barter the vortex of life for boundless bliss.  – Milarepa   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)