TZUTC: -0600
MSGID: 11089.bbs_carn@1:103/705 27f9e0ea
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PID: Synchronet 3.19b-Win32 master/a2a9dc027 Jan  2 2022 MSC 1928
TID: SBBSecho 3.20-Linux v320a_dev/a791c24b4 Dec  9 2022 GCC 12.2.0
BBSID: VERT
CHRS: ASCII 1
  To: Ryan Fantus
  Re: Re: FTelnet Y-Modem G
  By: Ryan Fantus to T.J. Mcmillen on Fri Dec 09 2022 04:30 pm

 > So I've stayed out of the conversation til now but feel compelled to respond
 > a bit here. I don't use Synchronet /or/ Renegade and don't have a dog in
 > this specific fight, but...where's the history file? A comprehensive
 > whatsnew or what differentiates one version to the next? Unless you're a
 > Renegade diehard, I don't see many people walking up and looking at RG as an
 > option without understanding what's happening with each release. It's pretty
 > black box. Just my $.02.

I think they have some imcomplete textfiles with some versions telling you
what you have to do to update.  It's really a hassle for people to take their
old renegade bbses and attempt to update it to a current version.

You have to merge the string files, do other various operations and run the
update.  It's almost impossible for someone to take their old bbs from years
ago and have it running on a newer version of renegade.  But tj doesnt want
that and has complained about me keeping old versions of renegade, asking why
I even do it.

 >  TM> Why would I make BBS setup with doors and everything else?  So some
 >  TM> dumb ass  can unzip it and put it online?  No.  This hobby was NEVER

To answer tj's question it was for 2 reasons. One i wont say because it's
obvious, so obvious people dont notice it. The best way to hide something is
out in the open.

The other reason is as an example of how to setup the most popular doorgames.

 >  TM> like those stupid mystic youtube videos.  Seriously?  If you can't
 >  TM> setup the BBS software from  the docs, YOU DO NOT NEED TO RUN ONE
 >  TM> because you
 >  TM> do not understand it at all!
 >
 > This hobby is whatever someone wants it to be. This is very gatekeeper-ish.
 > There are many cool BBSes online that leverage some more modern technology.
 > And the Mystic YouTube videos democratized FTN.
 >

It's a free country and people can do whatever they want to do.  TJ wants to
claim to be the renegade developer even though some other guy is always doing
the programming who adds these sad, small additions. Nobody can stop him. He
can keep editting wikipedia all the time with lies and keep going around
telling people to take down the renegadebbs.net links,etc.  I don't care.

He thinks renegadebbs.net is my site. He tells people to take it down because
it's my site and I'm such a jerk, etc. Whatever, I just host it.

I could do the same thing. I could put my name on renegade and make stupid
little changes because I'm a crappy programmer, or I could get someone else to
do it like tj does.  I just don't have the drive for dumb shit like that.

Regarding his documentation comments, the rg docs are very very old and do not
provide enough information on how to operate current versions of renegade and
the features that lee palmer and others have added. You have to find this
information by asking tj.  That's not a very good way to do things.

 > I rebuilt a car engine with the help of YouTube. No purists yelled at me
 > about doing it wrong since I didn't sit there with a howto manual printed in
 > black and white.

I had a mouse get in my garage and chew through wires in my car. When I
started up my car it blew out my main fuse and other components and fried
wiring.  without youtube(and amazon) I would have ended up paying 5k to some
garage when instead, i fixed it over a few weekends at my own pace.

 >  TM> Third, how many retards run their BBS in the cloud?   That is STUPID.
 >  TM> If you  don't want to put the time in, the money, the hardware, get out
 >  TM> of the hobby.  Oh hi, I run a BBS it's at blah blah blah, I log in
 >  TM> every
 >  TM> 5 weeks and see if  the VM on my cloudhost I PAY stupid amounts of

To answer tj's question, if you are smart you are running  your bbs on a
server.   It will always be up and it's easy to backup. it's not taking up
space at home.  He's just jealous because he couldn't do it for a few reasons.
He doesn't have the money. He doesn't understand linux.

 > How many people let the internet into their home firewall because they want
 > to run a DOS BBS? If you ask me, /THAT/ is what's retarded. I travel for
 > work a lot and run everything in the cloud because I'm not 14 sitting in my
 > parents' basement waiting for someone to dial into my BBS.

If you are on the internet and running any kind of server, that's like
painting a target on your back. My server has DDOS protection and techs will
actually jump in and handle attacks if it's needed.  People should not run a
server on their home internet. If all my stuff "crashes"(whatever that is,
sysops always use that word), I just copy it back over.

 > Anyway I don't intend to go back and forth and/or fight about this stuff, I
 > just felt compelled to call out the immaturity and gatekeeping here. Yeah,
 > you're talking to jas, but you're posting on a forum with other people, and
 > your general attitude here is one that makes me scratch my head.

Not jas; I'm mr professor now. It's because I'm so smart because I run servers
and use linux. Atleast to 16bit d'bridge author and tj, I am.
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