MSGID: 1:153/757.21@fidonet 04e04f4e
REPLY: 303.canada@1:2320/105 283bb87b
PID: OpenXP/5.0.57 (Win32)
CHRS: ASCII 1
TZUTC: -0500
Hello Rob!

 RM> I actually ran across some info on it since posting this
 RM> and it's not quite as easy as it sounds, the 'sellers'
 RM> have to do an actual identity theft to pull it off, having
 RM> drivers license numbers and Social Insurance numbers and
 RM> such, but we know these things still happen fairly
 RM> frequently.

Apparently we do not exist unless some flimsy document says so.

I know people who have lost their IDs, and the banks they have  
always patronized don't even allow them to access their money  
even though the tellers KNOW the person! Apparently the only  
way you can prove who you are is with a piece of paper.


 RM> They mentioned on the news that it is run most often by
 RM> organized crime. Something like 30 homes in Toronto alone
 RM> have been subject to this in the past year, mostly
 RM> Mortgage fraud, not the sale of the house fraud, which is
 RM> much harder to pull off.

Right.. sounds like a bunch of "fake" lawyers are in on the act  
and maybe even a banking insider is involved.


 RM> A story mentioned that in 4 cases the house was actually
 RM> sold, and one couple only found out about it because their
 RM> mortgage had been paid off - which would have to be done
 RM> before the house could be sold. (They were out of the
 RM> country for 4 years with the house rented out.)

Yes.. CBC radio elaborated a bit more about that case too.   
Incredible to learn that your own house has been sold  
fraudulently like that.


 RM> It was mentioned that 'the system' believes the new owners
 RM> legally own the property but there's no further info on
 RM> what can be done to get it back. It's apparently a little
 RM> messier than buying a stolen car..

It's probably the same process to return the property to the  
rightful owner but the players (the bank, the lawyers, etc) are  
reluctant because a house/property is usually a bigger ticket  
item ( 6 $ figures) as opposed to a car (5 $ figures), and  
those players don't want to take the losses - although THEY are  
the very parties that let it happen in the first place.


 RM> Everyone believes something should be done to prevent this
 RM> but it's one of those things where it will take time for
 RM> the law to catch up with the crime.. and I think That is
 RM> ridiculous too.. They should be able to pass something
 RM> virtually overnight to stop this. I'd imagine just making
 RM> the lawyer that put through the sale financially
 RM> responsible for the whole mess might put a stop to it
 RM> pretty quickly..

Yes.. I don't see why extra checks and balances can't be  
implemented immediately. For starters, if I were the bank or  
deed office facilitating the transfer, I'd question the  
legitimacy of the lawyers participating and any documents  
presented.

Eg. If the fraudsters were of a visible ethnic background, and  
the legit owners were something else, then that could be a red- 
flag.

I am a victim of a fraudulent property transfer myself, and *I*  
wasn't even informed by the deeds office or by the  
participating lawyer that it was taking place.
--
  ../|ug

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