XPost: alt.support.child-protective-services   
   From: ShermanT@adelphia.net   
      
   "Kane"  wrote in message   
   news:7ed8d1be.0409121127.7cb21edf@posting.google.com...   
   > On 12 Sep 2004 09:19:55 -0700, Greegor@hotmail.com (Greg Hanson)   
   > wrote:   
   >   
   > >Obvious bait, but I'd like to say that the one   
   > >thing worse than kids being property of parents,   
   > >is children as property of the state!   
   >   
   > I agree. In which countries is that true? Here in the US children are   
   > citizens with rights, the responsibity of which, falls to   
   > government...just as yours and mine do where we may not be able to act   
   > for ourselves.   
   >   
   > As children cannot, all too often.   
   >   
   > >The difference is that the STATE actually claims   
   > >such a right to this day.   
   >   
   > Really? Please give us something to work with here. Couch encrustation   
   > scabs are not sufficient.   
   >   
   > >In one Judges written decision they exalted   
   > >procreation on the grounds that it was   
   > >necessary to raise a work force and a standing army.   
   >   
   > Yep....should be sent to the workhouse, and shot by the army. Last I   
   > heard "one" judge is usually pretty insufficient in our system of a   
   > tiered judicial system, under watch of the media, the legistative and   
   > executive branches to make that stick.   
   >   
   > I believe you are correct in that the educational system is the main   
   > culprit, but on the other hand, consider this, he who sits and rots,   
   > lives off others, and hasn't served a day in the military defense of   
   > this country:   
   >   
   > If there were an insufficient workforce, with insufficient citizens to   
   > man our defenses, which language would you prefer, Japanese or German?   
   >   
   > The natives of this land found out. They got caught in the stone age   
   > by the age of steel. That did NOT work out well for them. They lacked   
   > numbers and they lack the tools of production on a scale and of a   
   > quality that could have thrown us back into the sea, more's the pity,   
   > when I see assholes like you sitting around spoiling life in this   
   > country.   
   >   
   > >There is actually a legal term for the state's   
   > >interest in being a parent, PARENS PATRIAE.   
   >   
   > Oh, wow! Latin. Now I AM impressed.   
   >   
   > Try some obsolete English, "RAGABASH" fits you quite well.   
   >   
   > >Even some parent who actually views their own   
   > >children as chattel (livestock) is vastly less   
   > >sinister than the Socialistic STATE's interest   
   > >in being a parent.   
   >   
   > Well, give that we can, or could, until the ASPCA and similar   
   > organizations got the laws changed, routinely torture, overwork,   
   > starve, and kill and eat our "chattle" if they were animals (which is   
   > not the actual current meaning of the word, simply the origin) then   
   > I'd say the state's "sinister" "socialistic" interest is well served,   
   > since it is bound to protect the rights of what were once considered   
   > "chattel." Children, women, at one time, slaves, the disabled, the   
   > weak, the disenfrancised.   
   >   
   > I kind of like that, even though I'm a conservative.   
   >   
   > >The truth about the state's past and ongoing   
   > >performance as a parent has been horrific   
   >   
   > Naw. they save thousands of children a year from folks such as you and   
   > worse than you. Chilren LIVE because of the intervention of the   
   > state...they escape hunger, torture, rape, and hopelessness, and the   
   > hell of self doubt and self loathing.   
   >   
   > You are a liar.   
   >   
   > >and in vastly larger NUMBERS than parents   
   > >with the mindset you cartooned.   
   >   
   > Oh, even though it's a troll, it's a droll characture of those with   
   > that mindset...very like yours.   
   >   
   > >By the way, the state's interest in kids as   
   > >chattel of the state is another motivation   
   > >for the LIBERTY INTEREST claims of families   
   > >exalted in the US Constitution and caselaw   
   > >to be circumvented routinely.   
   >   
   > Well now. Would you mind explaining what you mean by "chattel of the   
   > state?" Without "the state" those in resistence to the capturing of   
   > children to the economic models set down by the corporate barons of   
   > the 1800's would be in jail. I'm one of those in resistance. It's why   
   > I homeschooled my kids...but I sure didn't blame the state for being   
   > twisted in the education goals.   
   >   
   > Most of us are completely unaware of the monied interests power and   
   > control in that area. Ever notice the rich, even in pulblic schooling   
   > their children, tend to go to very different KINDS (not wealthier,   
   > just a very different curriculum...so you know what curriculum means?)   
   >   
   > The are taught to step into power while my children are taught to   
   > stept into factory mode, or military obedience mold. They are taught   
   > to be impatient and risk takers..my children are taught to be patient   
   > and put up with the boring of tasks...and even no task at all if jobs   
   > are in short supply...and to keep quiet and take it...while their   
   > children are taught to use my children for their risk taking   
   > ventures...well, you don't need a political philosophy lecture.   
   >   
   > You wouldn't get it anyway.   
   >   
   > But the point being: our government is nothing more than OUR social   
   > control instrument. Smart folks figure out how to fight back. Studid   
   > ones never do...they just collapse on the couch, diddle away their   
   > lives pointlessly, and whine about things, and their only "work" is   
   > that they do to remain blissfully ignorant.   
   >   
   > There's a book on line. All of it, free.   
   >   
   > If you want to get a real picture of "government" as in "schools" and   
   > how they came to be the tool of the rich they are, rather than the   
   > right of people, as they should be, you must read it.   
   >   
   > It's by a fellow named John Gatto...I kinda have a connection to him   
   > through the field of writing and publishing....but nevermind.   
   >   
   > He was awarded Teacher of the Year in NY state, a man that I think   
   > came late to education as a job, and promptly QUIT and walked and   
   > started writing an expose' of public education.   
   >   
   > Go, read. Expand your pitiful mind, and you'll have something to rant   
   > about the government that IS FACTUAL instead of your propaganda driven   
   > drivel.   
   >   
   > http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/chapters/index.htm   
   >   
   > http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/   
   >   
   > And no, I don't make a dime, though I do like him and his work.   
   >   
   > >George Orwell and Franz Kafka were optimists!   
   >   
   > While you think that clever, it is not. We have nothing like Orwell   
   > envisioned. Not in this country, and Europe may finally be learning   
   > and escaping that dangers of liberal thinking that creates such   
   > hellhole environments.   
   >   
   > Though England is going to the monitor everyone model...and that is   
      
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