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   can.legal      Debating Canuck legal system quirks      10,932 messages   

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   Message 9,691 of 10,932   
   no.top.post@gmail.com to All   
   Re. How does due process work?   
   02 Jun 12 13:13:56   
   
   XPost: uk.legal   
      
   Our law in the English speaking world: N America India &   
   the other ex-colonies is all basically the same; originating   
   from english law.  And the superficial differences should not   
   hide the common underlying principles and universally   
   applicable logic.   
      
   But apparently for expediency, law people don't [and eventually   
   apparently CAN'T] think from first principles.  To save effort   
   they just match up familiar phrases with stereotypical scenarios.   
      
   So eg. if you've got a dispute with the bank about your bicycle   
   loan: where the bank claims you owe $10 and you can prove   
   that you owe only $5, and you write a letter to the bank:   
   "Re. your bicycle-loan-claim for $10: please check my   
   documents enclosed, which prove that I owe $100 house   
   mortgage + $5 bicycle-loan = $105 total; and accept $105   
   gold-sovereigns from my messenger, and close my account,   
   else indicate any error in my documents."   
      
   And when you apply for the default judgment rescission,   
   perhaps because the    
   [and I notice that this applies also for the current UK rules]   
   in "next to the rules for setting aside a default judgment",   
   the clowns say you have no defence, because you admitted   
   owing more than the claim.   $105 is more than $10.   
      
   You don't believe me ?   
   Voice recording equipment and certified transcripts and   
   certified records are marvelous.  That's why an open press   
   is the cornerstone of a democracy.   
   ------------------   
   When I read the 'rules for different countries/jurisdictions, they   
   all feel completely understandable, reasonable and consistent.   
      
   So when I mention HERE "founding affidavit" why can't the   
   English law-boys see that my term "founding affidavit"   
   relates directly to their rule:   
   (Part 22 requires particulars of claim to be verified by a   
   statement of truth) ?   
      
   I tried to start from the must basic principle of "due process",   
   to see what terms THEY currently use for the key concepts.   
   But I can't get any sense, so I'll just use MY terms.   
   --------------------   
   Please comment on:   
   How would the highest appeal Court in YOUR jurisdiction act?   
      
   Scenario 1.   
   The procedure [equivalent to the UK "Part 8 procedure"]   
   called an APPLICATION [as opposed to an ACTION] is   
   simpler/cheaper and the decision is based on the   
   "founding affidavit" , "answering affidavit"   
   and possibly a further [from the applicant] "replying   
   affidavit", and even, rarely, permission from the court   
   for further affidavits, to clarify the FACTS.   
      
   The record/transcript shows that after the respondent had   
    before the    
   invited the pro-se' applicant to speak, the court said . Ie. he hadn't received/read the VITAL   
   affidavit, refuting the central fallacy of the answering affidavit;   
   and after locating it, hastily decided, based on the argument   
   of the answering affidavit.   
      
   Scenario 2.   
   In the same matter as 1 above, the Appeal judges effectively   
   acknowledge that the argument of the answering affidavit   
   which was refuted in the replying affidavit, which the trial   
   court had not accessed nor read before the hearing, was   
   absurd [putting cause AFTER effect] by introducing THEIR OWN   
   [Appeal judge's : mero moto] new/not-in-the-record,   
   argument which was also invalid.   
   1. In an adversarial system, it is not for the court to introduce   
   their own argument.   
   2. By throwing a new argument at the pro se' party   
   [standing up] they denied the appellant due process,   
   opportunity to disprove their argument.   
      
   Scenario 3.   
   At a sheriff sale/auction it was witnessed that the   
   land/house which was auctioned, was bid far above   
   market price, so that after the genuine bidders were   
   driven away, the sale was 'cancelled and said to be   
    and then the   
   land/house was re-auctioned to the scammers with   
   no competitive bid.   
   I'm speculating that the existing law allows this,   
      
     because   
      
   Scenario 4   
   sub-economic [government subsidised] houses for poor   
   ignorant people were noted to be being 'executed' by   
   shark lawers. A 'strange' lawer took it upon himself  [he   
   mentioned some thing about "giving the profession a bad   
   name"] to ride the matter up to the Constitutional Court.   
   Here's the punch-line: the con-court 

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