XPost: comp.theory, sci.logic, sci.math   
   From: polcott333@gmail.com   
      
   On 11/28/2025 2:18 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   > olcott kirjoitti 27.11.2025 klo 17.21:   
   >> On 11/27/2025 1:49 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>> olcott kirjoitti 26.11.2025 klo 17.17:   
   >>>> On 11/26/2025 4:01 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>> olcott kirjoitti 17.11.2025 klo 15.31:   
   >>>>>> On 11/17/2025 2:43 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>> On 2025-11-17 00:12:14 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>> On 11/16/2025 3:18 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-15 16:12:49 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>> On 11/15/2025 4:15 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-14 15:00:09 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/14/2025 3:21 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-13 15:50:37 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/13/2025 2:48 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-12 12:54:12 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/12/2025 1:09 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-11 13:04:13 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/11/2025 2:59 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-10 14:48:00 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/10/2025 3:43 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-09 12:51:57 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/9/2025 4:22 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-08 13:36:06 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/8/2025 2:05 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-07 12:57:48 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/7/2025 2:05 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-06 20:48:02 +0000, olcott said:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> D simulated by H cannot possibly reach its own   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulated final halt state.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is merely a defect in H and irrelevanto   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to the semantic and other   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> properties of D.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's a stupid statement.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stupid is better than false.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is stupidly false because you didn't bother   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to pay any attention at all.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A statement about me is off topic in comp.theory.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> H simulates D that calls H(D) that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulates D that calls H(D) that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulates D that calls H(D) that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulates D that calls H(D) that never reaches   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the simulated "return" statement final halt   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state of D because D calls H(D) in recursive   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulation.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Have you ever done any actual programming?   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A question about me is off topic in comp.theory.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But yes, I did yesterday.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *This is my key foundational point*   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> int H(char* P);   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> int D()   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> {   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    int Halt_Status = H(D);   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    if (Halt_Status)   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>      HERE: goto HERE;   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    return Halt_Status;   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> }   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The above is in test.c   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulate.exe implements a C interpreter.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulate test.c   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> runs the interpreter on the above source file   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from the command prompt.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Any program that does not correctly tell whether   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test.c halts is not   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a halt decider. A program that gives an incorrect   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> answer is not even   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a partial halt decider.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When this interpreter sees the call to H(D)   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it calls itself with the text body of D.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> According to C semanttics it should simulate H(D),   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> either simultating   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instructions of H or simulating the return from   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> H(D) with the same   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> returned value as H(D) would return if executed, or   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do whatever H would   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do if H would not not return.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is not the behavior that the input to H(D)   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> specifies.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulator.exe simulates Test.c. This simulates D that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calls H(D) that the simulator recognizes as itself.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is the behavour C semantics specifies. According   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to C semantics   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any other behavour that produces the same result is   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equally valid.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So D remains stuck in recursive simulation never being   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> able to complete its first statement before calling   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> H(D)   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> again and again.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If that happens then H does not return and therefore   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is not a decider.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe my work is over your head.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe the definition of "decider" is over your head.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> typedef int (*ptr)();   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> int HHH(ptr P);   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> int DD()   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> {   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    if (Halt_Status)   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>      HERE: goto HERE;   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    return Halt_Status;   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> }   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> int main()   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> {   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>    HHH(DD);   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> }   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> People here have consistently lied about   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DD simulated by HHH reaching its own "return"   
      
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