XPost: comp.theory, sci.logic, sci.math   
   From: mikko.levanto@iki.fi   
      
   On 15/12/2025 02:39, olcott wrote:   
   > On 12/14/2025 6:13 PM, Richard Damon wrote:   
   >> On 12/14/25 3:57 PM, olcott wrote:   
   >>> On 12/14/2025 1:55 PM, Richard Damon wrote:   
   >>>> On 12/14/25 11:32 AM, olcott wrote:   
   >>>>> On 12/14/2025 3:56 AM, Mikko wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 13/12/2025 23:32, olcott wrote:   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> All of the textbooks require halt deciders to   
   >>>>>>> report on the behavior of machine M on input w.   
   >>>>>>> This may be easy to understand yet not precisely   
   >>>>>>> accurate.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>> That is precisely accurate. The problem is exactly what the problem   
   >>>>>> statement says. You may define your problem differently but then   
   >>>>>> you just have another problem. The halting problem still is what   
   >>>>>> it was.   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> All the textbooks simply ignore that no Turing   
   >>>>> machine can possibly compute the mapping from   
   >>>>> the behavior from another actual Turing machine.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Sure it can, from the representation of it.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Just like it can add two numbers by using representatins.   
   >>>>   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> They can only compute the mapping from a finite   
   >>>>> string input that is a mere proxy for this behavior.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> And the proxy represents that same behavior, so it must get the same   
   >>>> result.   
   >>>>   
   >>>   
   >>> As I have conclusively proved many thousands of   
   >>> times that the behavior of DD AS AN ACTUAL INPUT   
   >>> to HHH does SPECIFY non-halting behavior.   
   >>   
   >> No you haven't,   
   > I say that I have proven this   
   > DD AS AN INPUT TO HHH(DD)   
      
   You keep repeating that the meaning of DD as imput ot HHH is different   
   from the meaning of DD per se. But you never say what that different   
   meaning is.   
      
   More importantly, you never tell what input to HHH would mean the   
   same as DD per se so HHH is not a halt decider and is not relevant   
   to any discossion about halt deciders.   
      
   --   
   Mikko   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)