From: janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com   
      
   On 29.10.2025 00:14, bart wrote:   
   > On 28/10/2025 21:59, Keith Thompson wrote:   
   >> [...]   
   >   
   > He (I assume) always dismisses every single one of my arguments out of   
   > hand:   
      
   No, I'm trying to speak about various things; basically my focus   
   is the facts. Not the persons involved. But there's persons with   
   specific mindsets (like you) that provoke reactions; on flaws in   
   your logic, misrepresentations, limited perspectives, etc.   
      
   >   
   > Build speed is never a problem - ever.   
      
   Like here. You're making things up. - For example I clearly said;   
   "Speed is a topic". But since you're so pathologically focused on   
   that factor that you miss the important projects' contexts. So I   
   then even quoted that (in case you missed it):   
   Speed is not an end in itself. It must be valued in comparison   
   with all the other often more relevant factors (that you seem to   
   completely miss, even when explained to you).   
      
   > The speed of any language implemention is never a concern either.   
      
   Nonsense.   
      
   > [...]   
   >   
   > When I gave the example of my language that was 1000 times faster to   
   > build than A68G, and which ran that test 10 times faster than A68G, that   
   > apparently doesn't count; he doesn't care; or I'm changing the goalposts.   
      
   Exactly. Or comparing apples and oranges. - Sadly you do all that   
   regularly.   
      
   > [...]   
   >   
   > On the face of it, it is uncontroversial: they do allow rapid   
   > development and instant feedback, as one of their several pros. Yet, JP   
   > feels the need to be contrary:   
   >   
   >>I can't tell about the "many" that you have in mind, and about their   
   > mindset; I'm sure you either can't tell.   
   >   
   > And now you have joined in, to back him up!   
      
   Bart, you should take Keith's words meant benevolent; all he's trying   
   was you not always assuming that we want to hurt you if we criticize   
   any misconceptions in your thinking or considering a topic only from   
   one isolate perspective. If you continue to assume that the "worst"   
   was meant, and only against you, you won't get anywhere.   
      
   Keith has explained in his posts exactly what was said and meant, and   
   made your discussion maneuvers explicit. (I would have been happier   
   if you, Bart, would have noticed yourself what was obvious to Keith.)   
      
   > [...]   
   >> [...]   
   >>   
   >> You misunderstood what Janis wrote.   
   >   
   > I understand what he's trying to do. He despises me; he thinks the   
      
   Obviously you don't understand, and certainly also don't know what   
   I think; if you would understand it you wouldn't have written this   
   nonsense.   
      
   > projects I work on are worthless.   
      
   Actually, as far as I saw your projects, methods, and targets, yes;   
   they are completely worthless _for me_. (Mind the emphasis.)   
      
   I also doubt that they are of worth in typical professional contexts;   
   since they seem to lack some basic properties needed in professional   
   contexts. - But that is your problem, not mine. (I just don't care.)   
      
   > [...] Meanwhile he's a 'professional', as stated many times.   
      
   Oh, my perception is that the regulars here are *all* professionals!   
   And (typically) even to a high degree. - That's, I think, one reason   
   why you sometimes (often?) get headwind from the audience.   
      
   What I'm regularly trying to tell you is that your project setups   
   and results might only rarely serve the requirements in professional   
   _projects_ as you find them in _professional software companies_.   
      
   You cannot seem to accept that.   
      
   Personally I'm not working anymore professionally. (I mentioned that   
   occasionally.) But I've still the expertise from my professional work   
   and education, and I share my experiences to those who are interested.   
      
   You, personally, are of no interest to me; your presumptions are thus   
   wrong. (I'm interested in CS and IT topics.)   
      
   Janis   
      
   > [...]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)