XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone
From: nuh-uh@nope.com
On 2026-01-09 14:07, Maria Sophia wrote:
> Tyrone wrote:
>> I have everything enabled on about 16 active devices. I have NEVER been
>> randomly prompted to enter my password. Not hourly. Not daily. Not monthly.
>> NOT "Every day, all day long".
>
> Hi Tyrone,
>
> This thread is a technical thread discussion how iOS really works, given no
> other common consumer operating system works how iOS does in this regard.
>
> So we all need to think and read the documentation and deal with the facts.
> Otherwise, we'll never be able to progress to a deeper iOS understanding.
>
> To that end, thank you for describing your personally memory of your user
> experience, where, in this very thread, we've seen the range of remembered
> personal experiences from those who claim they have absolutely no memory of
> encountering how iOS works with respect to authentication tokens expiry
> schedules, to those who have a memory of them, to those who tested it.
>
> Which user experience do you think is the more or less reliable?
> a. People who don't remember encountering what Apple documents is the case
> b. People who remember encountering what Apple documents is the case
> c. People who tested exactly what Apple documents is the case
>
> Since we wish to keep this discussion as the adult technical level...
>
> 1. Please realize I'm aware that your memory of your user experience
> is data which we are taking into account to understand how iOS works.
Are you though? Really?
>
> a. Your experience is data, however it is not a proof of how the
> system works for all users or all configurations.
Read that again, but replace the word "Your" with "My"
>
> b. Apple documents that its services use independent credentials
> and that those credentials need to be refreshed, even when
> you never explicitly "log out".
That is not what any documentation you have shown says.
>
> c. A user who always re enters the password or uses Face ID or
> Touch ID when prompted will see very different behavior from
> a user who refuses those prompts for months or years.
Except no one else has seen the behaviour you claim is the norm.
>
> 2. Apple documents independent services and credentials.
>
> a. Apple ID and iCloud are separate subsystems with their own
> authentication and state.
>
> Apple ID overview:
>
That is not what this says at all.
>
> iCloud overview:
>
Nor this.
What they say is that one's Apple Account (show that you actually care
about details by using the correct term, huh?) is what is used to give
you access to iCloud:
'Your Apple Account is what you use to access Apple services like the
App Store, Apple Music, iCloud'
>
> b. iMessage and FaceTime have their own activation and
> credential state. They are not simply "on" forever.
>
> iMessage and FaceTime activation:
>
Even if that were true, so what?
>
> c. App Store and purchase functions have their own sign in
> behavior. Apple documents that you can be asked to enter your
> Apple ID password again for purchases, downloads, and updates.
>
> App Store and Apple ID sign in:
>
>
> d. Find My and Activation Lock are tied to Apple ID ownership
> and device binding. Those are long lived, but not infinite.
>
> Find My and Activation Lock:
>
>
> 3. So why do password prompt frequencies differ between users.
>
> a. Number of services in use
>
> Two users can both say "I have everything enabled" yet still
> differ in detail. Examples, mail accounts in Mail, iCloud
> Mail on or off, iCloud Keychain, Family Sharing, region, and
> which app store content they use.
No. Because "everything" means everything.
Or is that FACT lost on you?
>
> b. How quickly prompts are satisfied
>
> If you enter your password, or use Face ID or Touch ID, when
> the system requests it, the underlying tokens get refreshed.
> In that case, short lived and medium lived token expiration
> events may be invisible to you.
>
> Remember I'm teswting how iOS works. You're not.
We have no evidence of that beyond your word...
...and your word isn't good.
>
> So I see exactly how iOS works, but for you, it's masked.
> I am explicitly refusing to re enter the password when asked,
> which forces repeated retries and escalations that you will
> not see if you glibly and repeatedly cooperate with the prompts.
>
> c. Silent retries and background failures
>
> Many token refresh failures are handled in the background.
> Short-lived credentials can be retried without showing the
> user anything unless the failures persist.
>
> So "I do not remember seeing many prompts" is not the same
> as "no token ever expired" or "no retries occurred".
>
> d. Device history and age
>
> A device that has been continuously upgraded and kept signed
> in for years, with regular successful re authentication,
> presents a very different history to Apple servers compared
> to a device that repeatedly refuses sign in prompts.
>
> 4. What "every day, all day" actually means
>
> a. It is shorthand for "frequent and persistent prompts over
> time", not a literal claim that the system prompts exactly
> once per hour on a fixed schedule.
>
> b. When you have a cluster of services all trying to refresh
> credentials and the user continually cancels or refuses, it
> is normal to experience the constant nagging every single day.
> Oct 27, 2023
> Dec 11, 2023
> May 20, 2024
> Aug 3, 2024
> Dec 8, 2024
> Dec 10, 2024
> Dec 16, 2024
> Dec 19, 2024
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