On Mon 2012-Oct-29 11:33, Marc Lewis writes:
ML> There is an optional modification offered where the mixer loses the
ML> Limiter and becomes a full 8 channels.  The stereo 1-2 input becomes
ML> channel 1 and the limiter becomes channel 2; the rest of the
ML> channels remain unaffected.

 RW>   I hope you folks recommend against that one, I can
 RW> understand offering it, but ... I never run headphone or
 RW> in-ear monitor (those little earbud) mixes without a
 RW> limiter. But then, to me that's a safety issue.

ML> Actually it's very popluar.  Although the SPL available at the ear
ML> drum varies with the type of headset, it can get quite
ML> uncomfortable.  It's rather up to the individual to exercise common
ML> sense.

YEah it is, but most of the individuals don't know what can
happen on a bandstand, or what they might be doing to
themselves with that earbud stuffed in the ear canal.  When
i control the mix for cans or earbuds it *always* has a
limiter between the mix bus/buses used and the wearer of the cans or buds. 
But then, that's me.  iS that defeatable
station by station?
YOu folks might want to warn potential custopmers of the
inherent dangers in defeating it.  I know i sure would.
REmember, a lot of folks who spend the money on this stuff
are clueless.

ML> In the service department I see lots of them (there are many tens of
ML> thousands out in the field.) The come from lots of
ML> churches, recording studios, educational institutions and
ML> individuals.

 RW> I'm curious how many of them you see where they've used that
 RW> modification. 

ML> I've installed about 80 of them so far; it is a new offering as of a
ML> few months ago. (I'm the guy that does all the mods.)

NOt bad.  I think when I did the mod I'd make sure they know that defeating
that limiter could be hazardous to fragile
eardrums etc. and make sure that warning jumped off the page at them.


ML> IIRC, I believe we also have an adapter to take ADAT optical input
ML> and produce a Hear Back output (Cat 5).  I'll check on that - that's
ML> something I never see in the service department. 


I'd bet so.  Adat optical to cat5 seems to be a pretty
common way of shipping audio around digitally these days.

 RW> Remember a lot of my work back in my live sound
 RW> reinforcement days was mixing monitors.  I recall when I
 RW> first read the phrase "friends don't let friends mix
 RW> monitors."  I've found though back when I was doing it that
 RW> performers who knew you were being diligent about getting
 RW> them what they needed to perform well did indeed thank you
 RW> for it.  i actually enjoyed it more than not.  When I didn't it was
 RW> usually working with less than professionals who
 RW> engaged in the volume wars all during the performance.

ML> That's where this type of system comes into play... virtually
ML> eliminating the volume wars and making it SO much easier for the FOH
ML> guy.

YEp, that's laways been as i've seen them advertised.  I
guess I'm interested in the perspective of the foh guys
whether they feel that after adopting such systems with a
group of performers who had these problems things improved.

I recall when in-ear monitoring first came out the big
selling point was lower stage volumes, etc.  But some tell
me that the volume wars just change their complexion.


 RW> I've used one but only in the studio, and only in someone
 RW> else's.  ONe time, and this was years ago, producing an
 RW> album project for some people who were less than
 RW> professional.  I'm comfortable in my own skin getting a
 RW> blend of what I need to hear whether on stage or in the
 RW> studio, but my encounters with personal mixing stations were doing
 RW> producer/engineer, hence the other side of the glass.
 RW> MOst of the performers picked up on the concept and could
 RW> work with it, but one in
ML>  particular couldn't quite wrap his
 RW> head around it.  I finally hooked a paralleled set of cans
 RW> up, set his mix up and told him to leave it alone from that
 RW> point on so we could finish the foundation tracks .

ML> There's one in every bunch, Richard. 

Oh yeah, always.  It's when you get those one in every crowd working together
and have two or three on the same bandstand that things get interesting .


Any of you folks out in the trenches in the field care to
jump on this one?

Regards,
           Richard
... Pre production planning prevents poor Performance!
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 * Origin:  (1:116/901)