XPost: alt.animals.ethics.vegetarian, rec.aquaria.freshwater.goldfish,   
   rec.pets.dogs.behavior   
      
   On Wed, 07 Sep 2005 15:17:55 GMT, Rudy Canoza  wrote:   
      
   >David Fuckwit Harrison lied:   
   >   
   >> On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 18:34:42 -0400, Logic316    
   wrote:   
   >>   
   >>   
   >>>David,   
   >>>you need to stop looking for fights and to get a formal education - your   
   >>>lack of comprehension of the most basic scientific procedures and   
   >>>established philosophical principles makes you unqualified to adequately   
   >>>handle any debate about consciousness, self-awareness, or experiments   
   >>>measuring animal intelligence in general.   
   >>>   
   >>>- Logic316   
   >>   
   >>   
   >>     The mirror test shows an individual's ability to understand reflection.   
   >   
   >No.  The mirror test shows an animal's self-awareness.   
      
       It really can't show that at all. A person will always have to wonder   
   if they're willing to think about it, if the animal simply has no concept   
   of its image being reflected, or maybe it has a concept of its own image   
   that is so different from reality that it would never consider the mirror   
   image to be itself. Both of those are much more likely than that it has   
   no concept of itself at all. It must have some concepts of itself, even   
   if those concepts only involve its own flavor, scent, etc. It could also   
   have other concepts, such as of itself running, or of itself eating, or   
   playing, etc. Such things are admittedly beyond your ability to consider,   
   but they are quite likely non the less.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)