XPost: sci.astro, sci.physics, sci.space.policy
In sci.physics Fred J. McCall wrote:
> jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>
>>In sci.physics Fred J. McCall wrote:
>>> jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>>>
>>>>In sci.physics Fred J. McCall wrote:
>>>>> jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In sci.physics Fred J. McCall wrote:
>>>>>>> jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>In sci.physics Fred J. McCall wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>At first I was going to respond to the whole thing then I realized most
>>>>>>>>of it was idiocy like not knowing how disease spreads and denial of
>>>>>>>>all the scholarly work that says there was a pre-columbian population
>>>>>>>>of 50 million to 100 million, 80 o 90 percent of which were killed
>>>>>>>>by European diseseses.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So you noticed your own delusions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>No, I quoted three scholarly sources, all of which said essentially
>>>>>>the same thing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't believe I am derided in any of your 'scholarly sources' unless
>>>>> you wrote them yourself.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>No, but you certainly are contradicted.
>>>>
>>>
>>> And how is that, chimp? What did I write (not what you read, what I
>>> wrote) that they 'contradict'.
>>>
>>
>>That the indiginous peoples were not wiped out by European diseases ...
>>
>
> Not what I said. Go read it again.
Yes, you did, several times.
>>
>>... and that there were few people in pre-columbian Americas.
>>
>
> Not what I said. Go read it again.
Yes, you did, several times.
>>
>>Why ask such a silly question when you said it several times?
>>
>
> Because I knew when you said it that what you came back with wouldn't
> be what I said. You really don't handle English very well at all, do
> you? Let me help you out just a bit.
>
> What I said was something like "many of the native peoples' died
> before they ever met a European".
Weasle wording; the mass die off started with the Europeans.
> Note that that is nothing like what
> you claim I said, unless you believe that there is some reason that
> disease cannot travel from native to native without an intervening
> European contact.
The diseases that caused the mass die off were non-existant in the
Americas before the Europeans arrived.
>
> What I said was "European explorers were surprised at how sparse the
> native population was". Note that this is not the same thing AT ALL
> as "there were few people in pre-columbian Americas". In fact, it's
> talking about POST Columbian America.
Which if flat wrong; European explorers were surprised at how many
people there were.
More weasel words.
The explorers were the start of post Columbian America.
> While there is no evidence I am aware of other than rough coincidence
> in time that the disease(s) were from Europeans, let's pretend for a
> moment that that's correct. Let's examine how what I said is exactly
> correct and how you, in your eagerness to accuse me of saying things I
> never said, actually read things I didn't write.
You mean other than they were non-existant until the first Europeans
arrived?
> Diseases move faster than settlers or even explorers, Chimp. So we
> get that initial European contact. One or more natives get something
> that they have no resistance to. They go back to their villages and
> expose a bunch of other natives (who have never met a European). Some
> of those folks travel in various directions (a relatively large
> population is going to mean travel and trade) and expose yet more
> natives who perhaps have not even HEARD of Europeans except as
> rumours. This goes on. 90% of the native population expires, most of
> them never having met, seen, or even heard of Europeans.
You are the one that kept babbling about MEETING a Eurpean, not me.
All I said was the Europeans brought the diseases.
> Meanwhile, Europeans, who are only present in small numbers, start to
> explore and/or settle. By the time they get any appreciable distance
> from the site of initial contact, much of the native population has
> died off. The Europeans are surprised at how sparsely populated the
> land is, not knowing that 90% of the people who lived there not all
> that long before have disappeared.
Finally got something correct.
> And there's the problem, Jim. You are so eager to pick fights with
> people that you read things they've never written in order to do so.
> That's well beyond merely being the asshole you present as and into
> pathological mental illness. And it's always the other person's
> fault, whether it's you misreading something, you having some problem
> with your newsfeed, or anything else. It's NEVER Jimp.
Blow it out your ass, lier.
> Well, this was all you. You made shit up I never said and then
> proceeded to act as if I'd said it and insult me because YOU were
> stupid.
Nope, you are denying what you said several times now that you are
backed against the wall.
>
>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Then I noticed you snipped the important part, so I'll just repost
that part.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You mean the biased part that misstates things?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I know a realist description bothers you space cadet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I know you wouldn't know a 'realistic description' if it came up and
>>>>> bit you, chimpshit.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I know you can't resist spewing bile and insults.
>>>>
>>>
>>> No doubt you 'know' all sorts of rather silly things. Why, if you
>>> didn't, you wouldn't be able to maintain your "I'm right and everyone
>>> else is wrong and mean to me" attitude.
>>>
>>
>>Gaffaw.
>>
>
> See above. And below.
>
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Establish a new family on Earth:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Already responded to this part, but I'll add one addition.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Load the horse drawn wagon the the wife, kids, hand tools, initial
>>>>>>>>provisions for the trip, some caged chickens and a sack of seeds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Find a nice spot near tree and water sources.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Plant seeds, cut timber to build cabin,d dig a well so as to not have
>>>>>>>>to walk as far to get water, build a chicken coop, take shelter in the
>>>>>>>>wagon until the cabin is built.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Dig a hole and build an outhouse so you don't have to walk to the woods
>>>>>>>>to take a dump. If you forgot to bring a plow, make a wooden one.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>While waiting for the first crop, forage for wild vegetables, fish, and
>>>>>>>>hunt game and eat some of the eggs from the chickens.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
[continued in next message]
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