XPost: sci.space.policy, sci.physics   
   From: fjmccall@gmail.com   
      
   Serigo  wrote:   
      
   >On 10/15/2016 6:07 AM, Fred J. McCall wrote:   
   >> jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:   
   >>   
   >>> In sci.physics Vaughn Simon  wrote:   
   >   
   >>> What I am saying is that turning dirt into structural steel or   
   >>> structural aluminum takes a lot of energy which you are NOT going   
   >>> to get from wind or solar on Mars.   
   >>>   
   >>   
   >> Wrong.  It doesn't require anything close to 50 MW.  As I pointed out   
   >> elsewhere, producing a ton of steel from ore takes about 5 MW-hrs of   
   >> power, all told.  Unless I need to produce 10 tons of steel per hour I   
   >> don't need a reactor anywhere near as big as what you keep proposing.   
   >>   
   >>   
   >   
   >        do you know how silly and insane that sounds ?   
   >   
   >You are proposing to set up an entire steel factory on Mars, and use 5   
   >MWhrs to produce 1 ton of steel from "ore".   
   >   
      
   Eventually.   
      
   >   
   >so where did you get your coke ?   
   >   
      
   It's just carbon.  The atmosphere is full of it and breaking that   
   stuff down to get oxygen is probably something we'd want to do   
   eventually anyway.   
      
   >   
   >Iron Ore ?   
   >   
      
   Hematite.   
      
   >   
   >Limestone ?   
   >   
      
   Don't need limestone.  I need calcium oxide.  Easily made from various   
   calcium deposits.   
      
   >   
   >O2 ?   
   >   
      
   Made from air and/or water.  Need to be able to make it to breath   
   anyway.   
      
   >   
   >Manganese?   
   >   
      
   Dig it up.  Rovers have found ore structures.   
      
   >   
   >Phosphorous ?   
   >   
      
   Dig it up.  Rovers have found it.   
      
   >   
   >Sulfer?   
   >   
      
   Mars has lots of sulfur.  Rovers have found it.   
      
   >   
   >Silicon ?   
   >   
      
   Easy, since the stuff is everywhere.   
      
      
   It's a whole planet, dude, and rovers have found high concentrations   
   of all that stuff even in the tiny area they've 'explored'.   
      
   >   
   >How heavy is ...   
   >   
      
   Who cares?  You can make it in however small a lot size you need to.   
   Nothing says you have to make it tons at a time.  And a single cargo   
   vessel brings in 100 tons of stuff.   
      
   >   
   >Mars surface dirt is more radioactive than Earth's dirt, so will your   
   >"Mars Steel" be.   
   >   
      
   You keep raising this like it matters.  It's insignificant and only   
   applies to 'dirt'; not so much to rocks under the 'dirt'.   
      
      
   --   
   "Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the   
    truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."   
                                  -- Thomas Jefferson   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
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