From: nicky.matthews@btinternet.com
On Saturday, August 23, 2014 5:33:52 PM UTC+1, Brian M. Scott wrote:
> On Sat, 23 Aug 2014 01:20:45 -0700 (PDT), Nicky
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> wrote in
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>
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> in rec.arts.sf.composition:
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> > On Saturday, August 23, 2014 3:02:34 AM UTC+1, J.Pascal wrote:
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> >> The revision... better? worse? pointless?
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>
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> I'm going to piggyback on Nicky's post so that I can combine
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> a few direct comments with some opinions different from
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> hers.
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> >> The spell itself informed her. The magic wove through
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> >> Eileen with tendrils of dreamlike meaning. "You are
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> >> summoned. We have summoned you. You are a demon, bound
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> >> to us and our cause."
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> > I like tendrils of dreamlike meaning, but it is hard to
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> > understand - maybe 'tendrils of magic wove through
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> > Eileen' and separate out the bit about meaning.
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> I think that the tendrils of dreamlike meaning are all that
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> she actually perceives of the spell. How about this?
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> Knowledge of a sort came with the spell itself. The
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> magic wound through Eileen in tendrils of dreamlike
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> meaning.
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> > How does she apprehend the meaning? Is this a dream or is
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> > she really there?
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> Not a problem for me: I don't need an answer yet.
>
This isn interesting because in real life neither do I, but I think it affects
the way you write the scene. Most writers distinguish between dream scenes and
normal action scenes by changing the writing style a little ( obviously not
all writers do, but
it is common) I think if it is a dream scene then you don't want to go into
the experiential details of what is going on because dreams are experienced
differently - so dreams usually include much more summary and often non
literal language too. If it
is a dream the language could be weirder. If it's real and this scene is
important then more experiential detail might help to give it more weight (and
the language could go further in the other direction. ) A lot happens in
this, but it is dealt with
quite quickly. As always, it depends what the author hopes to achieve - as
well as where it fits within the narrative. Maybe it is in a different style
from the rest or maybe to alter the style would give away too much and an
ambiguity as to its status
is important to the story. I think that is why commenting on short sections is
always a bit risky.
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> > This bit is really clear - maybe more detail about the
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> > first attempt so that the generalisation follows a more
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> > complete experience otherwise it is a tiny bit cursory
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> > and I'd like to see how hard she tried. Could she not
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> > pull herself over the lip using her arms - that seems as
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> > if it might be possible from the initial description.
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> No. To keep the numbers simple, suppose that she's five
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> feet tall. Then the bowl is a hemisphere with a radius of
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> ten feet, and its rim is a circle with a ten foot radius.
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> When she stands upright at the bottom of the bowl, the
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> straight-line distance from the top of her head to any point
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> on the rim is a little over 11 ft. 2 in. The straight-line
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> distance from her feet to any point on the rim is a little
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> under 14 ft. 2 in., and the distance along the surface of
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> the bowl is about 15 ft. 8.5 in. With blood already on her
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> feet, I don't see how she could possible run far enough up
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> the smooth sides of the bowl to reach the rim, even with her
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> arms at full stretch.
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: ) One of my characters failing to do the maths, and being desperate would
probably try, but maybe not if they were dreaming.
I found this really funny because I wouldn't have thought of it like this.
However, whether she made the attempt does depend on her character, degree of
athleticism, desperation, ambition or maybe just optimism. She didn't do it,
but I'm not sure exactly
what she did do except 'try to escape'. I think that is good enough for a
dream but for a real experience more might help. The brevity of the scene may
be a missed opportunity to show this character in action and thereby reveal
more about her. (
obviously if she isn't that important or the reader already knows her quite
well it probably wouldn't be worth the bother)
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> 'Crawled' works fine for me. In a context like this I don't
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> think that the literal sense of the verb is very important;
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> what's important are the mood and emotions that it evokes.
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> 'Crawled' suggests a slow and awkward progression, which
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> seems appropriate.
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Ah. I only like that in poetry or poetic writing, which is annoying because
finding the precise verb is incredibly awkward and not always achievable.
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> I have no strong preference for either version, but if I had
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> to choose, I'd say that the second is slightly better.
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>
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> Interesting. If I understand correctly, Eileen is initially
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> a human being, and the spell invoking a demon has in some
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> sense actually created one.
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>
That is an interesting thing I agree.
>
N
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>
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