XPost: alt.religion.wicca, alt.arts.poetry.comments, alt.magick   
   From: Aunty_Kreist@satanickittens.net   
      
   "Dale Houstman"  wrote in message   
   news:42262081.7080700@skypoint.com...   
   >   
   >   
   > Jani wrote:   
   > > "Dale Houstman"  wrote in message   
   > > news:4225EB8E.5010008@skypoint.com...   
   > >   
   > >>   
   > >>Tom wrote:   
   > >>   
   > >>>"Jane Asher's Vagina"  wrote in   
   > >>>message   
   > >>>news:1w6ghleaieht3$.1e99jreoeamyz.dlg@40tude.net...   
   > >>>   
   > >>>   
   > >>>>On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 22:13:42 +0000, Shez wrote:   
   > >>>>   
   > >>>>   
   > >>>>   
   > >>>>>People who practice the art and craft of magick see something in the   
   > >>>>>world that you don't see, its that simple..   
   > >>>>   
   > >>>>Sure is. They make shit up and convince themselves it's real.   
   > >>>   
   > >>>   
   > >>>Let me break it to you gently.  You do the same thing.  And, just like   
   > >>>everybody else, you strongly object to being accused of doing so.   
   > >>>   
   > >>>   
   > >>   
   > >>Certainly many people are self-deluded but it pure post-modernist tripe   
   to   
   > >>insist that all opinions are equal, as tempting as that lazy attitude   
   > >>might be nowadays. A person who believes the moon is made of green   
   cheese   
   > >>may be as wrong as a person who believes it is made entirely of silver,   
   > >>but the mistakes are on a different order, and one is closer to some   
   > >>version of the truth. Most people delude themselves into thinking the   
   > >>universe gives a blue spit about them - and the human race in general -   
   > >>but the one who thinks this is due to the Little People is less likely   
   to   
   > >>be correct than one who believes it is due to some unexplained yet   
   > >>probably material connection between "star stuff" and the makeup of the   
   > >>human matter. After all, science works upon probabilities, and some   
   things   
   > >>are simply more probable. Does this mean scuience has all the answers to   
   > >>life? Hardly, since human life is full of imaginative abstracts, but   
   > >>applying the rule that the truer answer is most likely the simplest   
   > >>answer, believing in "magick"  - while comforting to the person who   
   > >>believes in it (and there is nothing "wrong" sbout seeking a modicum of   
   > >>control and comfort in this world) is to believe in something that all   
   > >>experience and observation says is most improbable.   
   > >>   
   > >>The strange thing about - say - the Wicca movement is that they   
   celebrate   
   > >>and mimic the supposed behavior that was assigned to victims who were   
   > >>innocent of that behavior. Of all those "witches" who were condemned,   
   > >>tortured, and killed (and there were not as many as Wicca likes to say   
   > >>there were) not ONE was a witch, but only the innocent fodder for a   
   > >>political or religious porgram fueled by hysteria, rumor, envy, hatred,   
   > >>etc. The few who admitted to this "transgression" did so beneath torture   
   > >>or because they were mentally incapacitated, which isn't a surprise   
   given   
   > >>than schizophrenics and other mental "incompetents" were often singled   
   out   
   > >>as being in league with the devil, or some such.   
   > >>   
   > >>So the modern identification with these innocetns is based on the word   
   of   
   > >>their persecutors and their accusers.   
   > >>   
   > >>In effect, decalring oneself to be a "witch" (as harmless as it is) is   
   not   
   > >>unlike declaring oneself to be an eater of children based on ancient   
   > >>accounts of Jewish (or Christian) behavior. One is playing the role   
   > >>assigned by the enemy.   
   > >   
   > >   
   > > Can I just point out that none of the people from ARW who are   
   contributing   
   > > to this thread are Wiccan.   
   >   
   > Didn't say they were - only used Wiccan as one example of a modern   
   > "magick" movement. There are other forms of course; from the easily   
   > amused folks who read the Horoscope to the creepy guy who sells unicorn   
   > posters and herbs at the New Age shopping mall. And many in-between:   
   > even fundamentalist Christians are believers in magic, although they   
   > like to consider them "miracles." No difference all in all.   
   >   
   > The wider point is that there is no observable manifestation of "magick"   
   > in the world, and that the only "proof" of its existence is either   
   > heresay, madness, or the mutterings of Spanish Inquisition types. If the   
   > "magick" folks have a grasp of history, it seems to be a very slippery   
   one.   
   >   
   > dmh   
      
   I think many people unfamiliar with "magic" have a sort of idea of wizened   
   wizards, and Harry Potter type spells. Real magic is more subtle than that.   
      
   A good example that most non-magicals can identify with....take Reiki, for   
   instance. Reiki is a practice of manipulating the body's energies, either   
   internally, or sending those energies out. This is actually a form of magic.   
   There are also many types of martial arts that manipulate and control either   
   the body's energies, or the energies around them.   
      
   I do agree with that anyone who claims they can make trees talk, or turn   
   someone into a mouse belongs in the nuthatch. ;)   
      
   Magic is simply energy, to make it easy to comprehend to folks.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)