[continued from previous message]   
      
   >> NAMBLA meetings, listened to speakers at NAMBLA conventions, and taken   
   >> NAMBLA members out to dinner on several occasions, and could attest that   
   >> they were all good people.   
   >   
   > Stephan said a lot of things, on memory and without check, some of which   
   > were demonstrably untrue. (For example, his alleged dinners with NAMBLA   
   > were said to take place during Dylan's Rolling Thunder tour, which was   
   > years before NAMBLA was even founded.) there was no reason to trust   
   > his memory of any ot that.   
   >   
   >> NancyGene quoted posts Pickles had made in another forum, wherein he'd   
   >> argued that "legal age" was a meaningless concept, that the majority of   
   >> civilizations and cultures had no such age, that incest was not only   
   >> common in other cultures, but was a desirable thing.   
   >   
   > Yes, through all this NG continued to troll Stephan, and posted a lot   
   > of scurrilous claims about what he'd said (real, misprepresented, or   
   > completely   
   > made up). I didn't bother to check them, but (having been trolled by NG   
   > myself) I would nt vouch for their accuracy.   
   >   
   > IIRC, Ginsberg said that "legal age" was an arbitrary concept, which of   
   > course it is (just look at the USA, where the age of consent is   
   > different from   
   > state to state). he did not say that there was no age of cnnsent in   
   > other   
   > states, just that it varies. (For example, in much of the the Moslem   
   > world,   
   > the age at which a girl can be married is 9.) As for incest, NG found   
   > and   
   > quoted a statement Stephan made ridiculing "rape" charge laid aginat  a   
   > mother   
   > who'd had sex with her 17-year-old son.   
   >   
   >> Pickles not only defended his stance in said quotes, but further   
   >> informed us that he'd had sex with 14-year old girls (impregnating one   
   >> of them), and told us that he felt it was perfectly fine to have sex   
   >> with a 13-year old...   
   >   
   > I remember him claiming to have had sex with a 14-year-old he had   
   > married,   
   > he could have mentioned a second one - I did warned you not to take   
   > his statements at face value). He did point out that such marriages were   
   > legal under traditional Jewish law (just as they are in traditional   
   > Musim lae).   
   > IOW, he made the mistake of trying to respond reasonably with people who   
   > were   
   > trolling him.   
   >   
   >> but that if you went for anyone younger, you were   
   >> risking getting hurt because children that young were unable to maintain   
   >> lasting romantic relationships.   
   >   
   > As I've told you, children who haven't reached puberty don't even have a   
   > sex drive. (You, quoting some psychologist, disagreed.) And even   
   > teenagers   
   > above the age of consent are usually unable to maintain lasting romantic   
   > relationships.   
   >   
   >> Nice guy, that Pickles.   
   >   
   >> Since you have always been jealous of Jim's popularity here,   
   >   
   > Now that is not true, Lying Michael. Jim and I had a great relationship   
   > before you three formed Team Monkey and began to troll and flood the   
   > group   
   > with attacks on both Stefan and Will.   
   >   
   >> and since   
   >> Pickles was a friend of your lifetime ally, Will Donkey,   
   >   
   > Now, that is absurd, Lying Michael. Will and I have never even met; and   
   > while I had as good a relationship with him on the group as I did with   
   > Jim, we were hardly conversing in those days.   
   >   
   >> you jumped into   
   >> the fray as well.   
   >   
   >> You not only supported both Ginsberg and Pickles   
   >   
   > I agreed with both of them (and SCOTUS and most legal scholars) that   
   > NAMBLA had a First Amendment right to talk about such things.   
   >   
   > , but   
   >> you mistakenly claimed that NAMBLA had done more to support LGBT rights   
   >> than any other organization.   
   >   
   > No, Lying Michael. I told you that I agreed that gay sex for anyone   
   > above the age of consent should be legal, pointed out that NAMBLA was   
   > the only   
   > group in Canada campaigning for that, and even called you a "homophobe"   
   > when   
   > you insisted that it should continue to be illegal.   
   >   
   >> You later retracted that claim, but the   
   >> damage to your reputation had already been done.   
   >   
   > No, Lying Michael. I still believe that gay sex between "children" above   
   > the   
   > age of consent should be legal, while you continue to lie and   
   > misrepresent   
   > that claim.   
   >   
   >> BTW: Who is MFH?  I'm having difficulty placing the initials.  Is it a   
   >> typo?   
   >   
   > MFH = "My Father's House". That's a poem of mine you may have read.   
      
   In 2017 Stephan Pickering came to this newsgroup to post poetry and   
   discuss poets and poetry.   
      
   Almost immediately, Jim Senetto, Michael Pendragon and Nancy Gene began   
   efforts to drive Pickering from the newsgroup.   
      
   Over the next 5-6 years any poets who arrived here were either driven   
   away or this was attempted, by Pendragon, Senetto, Nancy Gene and their   
   gang of troll thugs.   
      
   That's how it happened, and could even happen again.   
      
   HTH and HAND.   
      
   --- SoupGate-DOS v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)