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   rec.arts.poems      For the posting of poetry      500,551 messages   

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   Message 499,930 of 500,551   
   W.Dockery to HarryLime   
   Re: Will Dockery's "Shattered" (2/3)   
   19 Feb 25 16:26:25   
   
   [continued from previous message]   
      
   > signify that.  Your sentence appears to be bemoaning the fact that no   
   > one ever traced their image on a piece of transparent paper.   
   >   
   > And what's with the "never ever"?  People stop saying "never ever" at   
   > the age of 5 or 6.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  If some morning I wake   
   >>>>>>  here for you   
   >   
   > Again, this is torturous prose.  It should be "If I awake some morning."   
   >  In your line, the speaker is pondering the consequences of his waking   
   > up a morning.   
   >   
   > "Here," again, is superfluous -- where else would you be expected to   
   > wake?  "There"?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  trying to find some reason to return   
   >   
   > At this point, your speaker is babbling incoherently.  One doesn't wake   
   > up in the middle of attempting to find a reason for doing something.   
   > One wakes up from sleeping.   
   >   
   > And, you have yet to identify who this person being addressed is.   
   >   
   > This is another earmark of a Will Donkey poem -- addressing various   
   > pronouns (you, he, she, it, they) without identifying them to the   
   > reader.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  if I see things denied   
   >   
   > It's impossible to tell if this line relates to that preceding or   
   > following it.  It doesn't make sense either way.   
   >   
   > Is he seeing things he once defined denied?  What did he define?  For a   
   > person to "define" something would mean that he was the perfect symbol   
   > of that particularly quality or characteristic (Joe was the definition   
   > of courage).   
   >   
   > Or is his waking contemplation of the possibility of returning to...   
   > some unidentified thing (a relationship?) being denied by the   
   > unidentified someone's actions?   
   >   
   > You need to learn how to convey information to your readers.  Language   
   > is about communication.  It is the means by which we pass on   
   > *information* to others.  When your poetry hints at vague relationships   
   > with unidentified pronouns, it is failing to express anything.   
   >   
   > Vaguery can be used to a poem's advantage -- but the *entire poem*   
   > should never be incoherent.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  I once defined   
   >>>>>>  a life just passed me by there   
   >   
   > Where's "there"?  If the life "just" passed you by, it would have done   
   > so just a few seconds ago, so "there" should be "here."   
   >   
   > But earlier in the poem, you'd said that someone else's life had just   
   > passed by.   
   >   
   > Which life was it?  The speaker's life?  Or the unidentified "you" he is   
   > addressing?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  slipped through my fingers   
   >   
   > This is just another way of saying "passed me by."  If a line doesn't   
   > add anything to the poem, you should cut it.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  everything here now is real   
   >   
   > WFT?   
   >   
   > Was everything not real a moment ago?   
   >   
   > More importantly, *what* has become real?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  so wait.   
   >>>>>>  That portion of the finish   
   >>>>>>  never comes.   
   >   
   > I'm guessing that you were stoned out of your senses when you wrote   
   > this, and that it all made perfect sense to you at the time?   
   >   
   > Are you telling the unidentified "you" (whose life had passed --   
   > implying that they had died) to wait?   
   >   
   > Are you telling yourself to wait -- as your train of thought jumps   
   > tracks?   
   >   
   > Or are you telling the reader, who you haven't been addressing, to wait?   
   >   
   > And why use "portion" rather than "part"?  It just sounds false (like a   
   > child attempting to use "big words").   
   >   
   > And just what part of what finish are you referring to?   
   >   
   > Everything has suddenly become real (even though you had given no   
   > previous indication that it was false, and even though you've failed to   
   > even hint at what "real" and "everything" relate to), is meant to be a   
   > false finish that never comes (and is, therefore, not a finish)?   
   >   
   > That would sound vaguely profound if it actually had any intelligible   
   > meaning.   
   >   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>  Now that the lights are going so low   
   >>>>>>  the dimming glow   
   >>>>>>  falls on my ego   
   >   
   > We have now arrived at the point in a Will Donkey poem, when I'm   
   > inwardly screaming out "SHOOT ME NOW!!!"   
   >   
   > How does the dimming glow of some lights affect your speaker's ego?   
   > Does he feel inconsequential at dusk?   
   > u   
   >   
   >>>>>>  now that I'm falling   
   >>>>>>  into my morning   
   >   
   > So your speaker is still lying "here" (or, perhaps, "there") waking up   
   > from contemplating returning to someone or something, and the lights   
   > have suddenly dimmed?  Was there a brown out?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  here I am gazing into those   
   >>>>>>  reflector eyes   
   >   
   > Is the (supposedly deceased) "you" he's been addressing actually lying   
   > on the floor with him (not having "passed by" him at all)?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  morning light   
   >>>>>>  is blasting my head clean too.   
   >   
   > "Too"?  Too implies that he'd already told us about something else that   
   > the morning light was blasting clean.   
   >   
   > So... basically, the speaker had gotten drunk and/or stoned, passed out   
   > either here or there, woke up contemplating whether he should return to   
   > someone or something, rambled incoherently about how his life (or the   
   > life of someone else) passed him by... until the morning lights dimmed,   
   > blasting his head clean.   
   >   
   > Got it.  NOT!   
   >   
   >>>>>>  Morning's clearer   
   >>>>>>  I've been forgetting it.   
   >   
   > Donkey, Donkey, Donkey [shakes head], always with the pronouns.  The   
   > speaker has been forgetting what?   
   >   
   > And how can morning be "clearer" when it had never been described as   
   > being "unclear"?   
   >   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>  Your thoughts seem to stream   
   >>>>>>  like a highway   
   >   
   > Light streams.  Highways don't.   
   >   
   > Who is the speaker addressing?  Himself?  The morning?  The unidentified   
   > person whose "uncaused" and "untraced" life had passed him by?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  dimming lights seem to streak   
   >>>>>>  like hitch-hikers.   
   >   
   > "Hitchhikers" is not hyphenated.   
   >   
   > Why would morning lights be dimming again?  Usually the ambient light   
   > increases as the sun continues its ascent.   
   >   
   > And why are the hitchhikers streaking?  I realize this was written in   
   > the 70s when streaking as still a thing, but I don't believe that the   
   > two (hitchhiking and streaking) went together.   
   >   
   > And even if there were dim streaks of light in your "here" (or,   
   > possibly, "there"), how does dim light recall a hitchhiker (naked or   
   > dressed)?   
   >   
   >>>>>>  When does this dream end?   
   >   
   > WHEN DOES THIS GODAWFUL POEM END???   
   >   
   > I'm not joking, Donkey.  A poem needs to grab, and hold, the reader's   
   > interest. Since I have no idea what you poem is about (other than your   
   > waking up still feeling the effects of the previous night's drugs), I   
   > have *ZERO* interest in it.   
   >   
   > I don't know who is speaking.  I don't know who he's speaking to.  I   
   > don't know what he's prattling on about.  Hell, I don't even know if   
   > he's here or there.   
   >   
   > And, as a consequence, I cannot invest any interest (much less feelings)   
   > into his (non-) story.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  When do I get on up the road?   
   >   
   > "Get on up the road"?  That's not even decent backwoods slang.  When   
   > speaking about reaching a destination (literal, spiritual, etc.), one   
   > says "down" the road.  "Up" the road implies back to the start of your   
   > journey.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  The light sped out   
   >>>>>>  like a fire-fly   
   >   
   > "firefly" is not hyphenated.   
   >   
   > So the dimming, streaking, hitchhiking light is now a hastily departing   
   > firefly?   
   >   
   > Pick ONE metaphor and stick with it.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  like gravestones   
   >>>>>>  never noticed   
   >>>>>>  never seen.   
   >   
   > OMFG!   
   >   
   > Now the dimming, streaking, hitchhiking, hastily departing firefly like   
   > light has turned into unseen gravestones???   
   >   
   > I can't wait to discover what the morph into next.   
   >   
   >>>>>>  Like marbles   
   >>>>>>  spilling from shattered minds.   
   >   
   > There it is!   
   >   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-DOS v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)   

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