From: fiultra1@yahoo.com   
      
   On Sunday, July 14, 2013 10:49:07 AM UTC+1, patrick-turner wrote:   
   > Andre asked me a question......   
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   >    
   >  Andre Jute Jul 13 (18 hours ago)    
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   > Other recipients:    
   >    
   > On Saturday, July 13, 2013 6:51:14 AM UTC+1, patrick-turner wrote:    
   >    
   > > But I had a customer with 3 stacked pairs of ESL57 and I sold him an 8585   
   tube amp to drive them.    
   >    
   > Three pairs stacked two, two and two, or two pairs stacked three and three?    
   >    
   > Andre Jute    
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   >    
   > Allow me to explain exactly. The customer had a total of six (6) ESL57   
   speakers.   
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   >    
   >    
   > For each L and R channel, three were placed vertically on top of each other   
   to make a virtual single panel with height = 3 x height of one speaker, and   
   aligned on the one vertical axis. The guy had timber stands made to do this   
   very easily. The two    
   channels meant two stands maybe 3M apart. He sent me a picture of his system.   
   >    
   >    
   >    
   > One could say that he had a virtual line array of drivers for each channel.   
   Because of the height of the stacked speakers, and most probable large   
   differences in speaker to ear path length then there must have been serious   
   >    
   > variations in level for MF and HF due to phase of signals arriving at the   
   ear.    
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   >    
   >    
   > This raises a question about the "rightness" of line arrays regardless of   
   the drivers used, because of timing issues. But where I have been at outside   
   public concerts with line array public address, the music has always been far   
   better to listen to    
   than where old fashioned bins were piled up around the stage and played loud   
   to deafen front rowers, but yet be devoid of HF content, presumably for   
   acoustic FB to mic problems. So, one can reproduce music with amps and   
   speakers and commit huge    
   engineering sins and have ppl find they like it.   
   >    
   > Being an old phart, I avoid "gigs" with loud amplified sound - like the   
   plague.   
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   >    
   >    
   > For hi-fi, line arrays and stacked ESLs present special problems, IMHO. The   
   best ESL I heard belonged to a guy Chris Feliefe, a gentleman of Roseville in   
   Sydney, and he built his own ESL after many years of research. He was able to   
   make a very fine    
   sounding system with only 16 Watt SET amps using well designed OPTs and 6C33c   
   tubes. Music was natural, fresh, lively, balanced and warm. Panels were not   
   huge. I could have listened forever. Once I heard Martin Logans, 1.2M high,   
   with subs, and I thought    
   they gave superb sound, even with an SS amp. But two other Quad ESL systems I   
   found to be kind of harsh, and so I've found it impossible to agree Quads are   
   the best. But whatever I think about sound of ESL doesn't matter, I am just a   
   retired amp worker,    
   but I suggest all readers keep an open mind, and be prepared to try things   
   based on applied science rather than applied snake oil.    
   >    
   > Patrick Turner.   
      
   Arrays are okay in their place -- outdoors, as you say -- but I have my doubts   
   about the efficacy of large-unit or large-number indoor arrays. Seems a waste   
   of ESL, to put it mildly.   
      
   Andre Jute   
      
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