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|    rec.audio.tubes    |    Tube-based amplifiers... that go to 11    |    52,877 messages    |
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|    Message 52,618 of 52,877    |
|    johnnhelen4@gmail.com to All    |
|    Re: GZ34    |
|    04 Aug 17 09:39:03    |
      The PS transformer is wound serially so that the two sides of the winding are       not the same resistance.              I did the work on this all of 20 years ago. The results got published in Glass       Audio Volume 10, Number 3, 1998 & Electronics World (June 1998). And posted on       RAT, several times over several years. I’m surprised you are unaware of it.       The resulting        problem applies only to SET amplifiers, although PS hum sidebands do show up       on the output off PP amps. Measured & posted that too.              The simple, low cost fix reduces the power frequency (60 Hz)hum component as       much as 20 db. A simpler fix reverses the HV leads to the rectifier. That way       for a filamentary rectifier such as the common 5U4G one of the HV wdg will be       in series aiding        while the other is series opposing to the 5V across the cathode surface. That       is enough to yield a 15 db reduction in the power frequency component. And       costs us nothing. Half of the amps built probably have those leads hooked up       wrong way around.              Better measure some of your power transformer HV windings carefully. That is       easy these daze with a digital meter. If you find any where the halves are the       secondary are the same resistance, post the p/n & manufacturer here. Any       I’ve ever looked at        were in all cases different resistance.       Most of the schematics show resistance for the halves of the secondary to be       the same. But they are not. Quite a few of the old radio schematics out of the       30’s show the actual HV resistances. For example, the Philco 37-93 is given       as 230R & 250R.               I'm not sure how having a tube rectifier there, vs solid state, would       in        any way improve the hum factor.              But there is a difference. The forward resistance of a SS diode is much less       than a Toob. So the charging currents are larger, if all other things are left       the same. The there is more hum resulting. Much of the work on that was done       in the 30s by Terman &        others, all in his textbooks. And copied into the Radiotron Designers       Handbook (RDH4), commonly used by many of us old guys. All easy reading.               As for the PS transformer, they were obviously being cheap if that       happens.              Not cheap at all, simply makes good business sense. Over many years in sales       with HP & R&S I had quite a bit of contact with Hammond. One comment I recall       had to do with the relative cost of a tap vs. starting another winding. By the       time that extra step        filters thru to the end user it could be significant. Sales volume depends on       reasonable cost as well as perfection.               one appeal of tube vs solid state rectifiers is the 'punch' effect you        get with a guitar amp. At high load you get an 'attack/decay' amplitude        effect because the capacitors discharge for a short time, giving you        slightly higher power levels than the power supply can deliver with a        sustained signal. This is due to internal resistance of the rectifier        tube. But if the behavior is non-linear, having a series resistor on a        diode won't give you the same effect...                Anyway, they should be using LC filters after the diode to minimize       hum,        and a properly balanced power transformer secondary winding. That's how        the old Hi Fi systems were done. Just boost secondary voltage a bit to        compensate...                /me would consider adding a series voltage regulator using a transistor        and zeners and solid state rectifiers and a current limiting circuit, to        give you a nice clean primary power supply that doesn't 'surge' the        capacitors when it starts up.               SS circuitry makes life easy in many ways, so SS regulation is a possibility.       Not so much when Williamson & the others got going.               A 25-50V drop would be sufficient, not        unlike what you get with a tube rectifier anyway.                but yeah, that's not very 'purist' of me. I just think the pre-amp and        output tubes are what matters for hifi tube audio, or guitar amp audio        for that matter. The power supply [other than the 'punch' effect] is        less important, but could be simulated if needed, using a derivative of        a current limiter circuit.               The guitar pickers & other electronic musicians have much greater problems to       solve than PS hum. Ground loops can be a killer. It is somewhat of a surprise       that we don’t see a lot more balanced systems as used in broadcast where 600       ohms transformers        are used. There certainly have the audio bandwidth required. But here again       cost is a killer.              This note is not meant to flame you or anyone else. Just some information       where I’ve had a careful look at a potential problem & found a reasonable       way out!              --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05        * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)    |
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