XPost: comp.mobile.android, comp.mobile.ipad   
   From: jollyroger@pobox.com   
      
   On 2014-03-12, Brent  wrote:   
   > On 2014-03-12, Jolly Roger  wrote:   
   >> On 2014-03-12, Brent  wrote:   
   >>> On 2014-03-12, Jolly Roger  wrote:   
   >>>> On 2014-03-11, Brent  wrote:   
   >>>>> On 2014-03-11, Jolly Roger  wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 2014-03-11, Brent  wrote:   
   >>>>>>> On 2014-03-11, Jolly Roger  wrote:   
   >>>>>>>> On 2014-03-11, Lewis  wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> If you drive 55mph where the flow of traffic is 70mph then   
   >>>>>>>>> *you* are a hazard. Many of those idiots you see are trying to   
   >>>>>>>>> avoid an un-anticipated impediment.   
   >>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>> Depends very much on the circumstance. What if the speed limit   
   >>>>>>>> is 55?  What if there are multiple flows of traffic - some   
   >>>>>>>> obeying the speed limit, and others not? Very often, I'll be   
   >>>>>>>> driving with cruise control set to 55-60 in the middle lane of   
   >>>>>>>> a 3-lane highway where the posted speed limit is 55, where most   
   >>>>>>>> of the cars around me are doing similar speeds (again, around   
   >>>>>>>> 55-60), and a group of cars (usually anywhere from 2 to 6 cars)   
   >>>>>>>> will come up from behind driving significantly faster than 55   
   >>>>>>>> (sometimes 15-25 miles faster (yes: 75-85 mph in a 55),   
   >>>>>>>> speeding much faster than the traffic around me), usually with   
   >>>>>>>> one or two idiots leading the pack in some sort of apparent   
   >>>>>>>> race to see who can get wherever faster. Inevitably one or more   
   >>>>>>>> drivers in the speeding group gets upset that the drivers in my   
   >>>>>>>> group are "in their way", usually in various lanes (almost   
   >>>>>>>> never just the left lane), and start tailgating and using   
   >>>>>>>> aggressive and fast lane switching maneuvers in all three   
   >>>>>>>> lanes, often making double-lane-switches without signalling   
   >>>>>>>> within a few feet of other cars and pulling other dangerous   
   >>>>>>>> stunts to get past these "slow" drivers that are imposing such   
   >>>>>>>> an inconvenience on their little racing game as quickly as   
   >>>>>>>> possible, safety be damned. In such a situation, I'd typically   
   >>>>>>>> like to gradually decrease my speed, and make safe lane changes   
   >>>>>>>> to the right to get as far away from the idiots as possible, if   
   >>>>>>>> and when such opportunities safely become available.   
   >>>>>>>> Unfortunately, very often, due to the tailgating aggressive   
   >>>>>>>> behavior of the speeding group, there isn't a good opportunity   
   >>>>>>>> to do that until *after* they've finished making their   
   >>>>>>>> dangerous maneuvers and sped on past. I'm probably one of the   
   >>>>>>>> last people who will just gleefully increase my speed to match   
   >>>>>>>> the speed of the idiot group when I see them coming in my rear   
   >>>>>>>> view mirror - especially if I'm not in the passing lane and I'm   
   >>>>>>>> already at or exceeding the posted limit, and the cars around   
   >>>>>>>> me are doing the same speed as me. Nor am I going to quickly or   
   >>>>>>>> dangerously make lane changes just to get out of their way to   
   >>>>>>>> make their dangerous behavior easier for them to continue.   
   >>>>>>>> Safety comes first, and I naturally value the safety of the   
   >>>>>>>> well-behaved drivers around me more than speeding jackasses.   
   >>>>>>>> BTW, this isn't a cherry-picked example situation - it happens   
   >>>>>>>> *all* *the* *time* on American highways.   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> What happens on grossly underposted limited access highways is   
   >>>>>>> that drivers like Jolly here form packs that impede flow.   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> I'd like to understand your logic better. Are you suggesting that   
   >>>>>> every 55 MPH highway in America us grossly under posted, or just   
   >>>>>> the ones on which I personally travel? Are you suggesting that   
   >>>>>> those exceeding posted speed limits do not form packs? Also, how   
   >>>>>> do you know the road conditions of the highways I typically   
   >>>>>> travel? Are you secretly following me, or do you have telepathy   
   >>>>>> and know which highways I travel?  Please explain.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Your opinion of the PSL is irrelevant. You unwittingly described   
   >>>>> the conditions of a grossly underposted limited access highway.   
   >>>>> The condition you describe does not happen where the road and PSL   
   >>>>> match well.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Seems like you are saying the mere fact that people speed is an   
   >>>> indication that speed limits are under what they should be. Is that   
   >>>> what you mean?   
   >>>   
   >>> Look up the 85th percentile method in your spare time.   
   >>   
   >> A simple yes or no would suffice. I'll take that as a yes unless you   
   >> state otherwise.   
   >   
   > Seems like you are saying the mere fact that people put a number on a   
   > sign means that is the absolute maximum speed, is that what you mean?   
      
   No, I'm asking you a question, and you are dodging the answer.   
      
   >>>>>>> Faster drivers then go from pack to pack, neededing to find a   
   >>>>>>> way through each pack, often doing a Claybrook weave.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>> So the dangerous behavior I describe above is necessary in your   
   >>>>>> view?  Strange. Do you prioritize speed over safety?   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Seems in your opinion dangerous is going faster than you.   
   >>>   
   >>>> Anyone with an average IQ can see that I described many behaviors   
   >>>> besides just going faster than the posted speed limit above. I   
   >>>> disapprove of all of the dangerous behaviors I describe above.   
   >>>> Trying to ignore the rest to prove a point is only going to make   
   >>>> you look foolish, as if you have no real argument. Wanna try again?   
   >>>   
   >>> Again, if you kept right except to pass they would simply pass you   
   >>> by on the left.   
   >   
   >> Oh, if only life were that simple. No, even when you are in the right   
   >> lane, someone may cut in front of you at a dangerous distance, or   
   >> tail gate you to try to push you to go faster so thy can get around   
   >> someone in the middle lane. There are all sorts of dangers that   
   >> driving like a fast and furious fan presents, and none of them are   
   >> the fault of the people who are driving safely. It really does seem   
   >> like you want to blame everything on the people who *aren't* acting   
   >> like complete idiots.   
   >   
   > Again, keep right except to pass.   
      
   I and lots of others do just that - and yet the problem remains. Imagine   
   that.   
      
   > Nobody is going to cut right if everyone keeps right except to pass.   
      
   Wrong. I see people cut right all the time when they could use the left   
   lane, usually out of impatience or similar stupidity.   
      
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
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