From: invalid@invalid.invalid   
      
   "Don Y"  wrote in message news:10g8   
   9c$vrte$1@dont-email.me...   
   >>> I think the bigger problem is the ego and (type of) involvement of the   
   >>> parent(s).  I've spoken with many teachers who claim they are afraid to   
   >>> grade their students based on merit -- the parents raise holy hell   
   >>> if THEIR kid isn't an "A" student.   
   >>>   
   >>> [Not unexpected in light of the prevalence of helicopter parents -- did   
   YOUR   
   >>> parents ever attend a job interview with you??]   
   >>   
   >> I would have been horrified if my parents had ever suggested that they   
   should   
   >> attend a job interview with me.   
   >   
   > Sadly, that is not the case, presently.  I see this as an extension of the   
   > "my kid is the best -- and don't you say or think otherwise!"... even if   
   > the kid is dumb as a post!   
   >   
   >>> This instills a false sense of "competence" in the kid.  A neighbor's son   
   is   
   >>> upset that he hasn't been PROMOTED after 6 months on the job... what the   
   hell   
   >>> have you DONE in those 6 months that thinks you MERIT a promotion?   
   >>   
   >> Hmm I probably was promoted after 6 months in my first job. That's partly   
   because   
   >> that's what the organization did with new graduates but it's also partly   
   because I could   
   >> use a soldering iron and do plenty of other things I wasn't taught on a   
   degree course.   
   >>  From a coding point of view I could not only code (mostly in assembler)   
   but I had   
   >> already seen many examples of how to do things. So when I had to get an   
   8051 to   
   >> do 32-bit division and convert the result to decimal for a display it   
   wasn't too hard.   
   >   
   > I never had an "entry level" full time job.  I was always a senior design   
   > engineer or system analyst or etc.  I always had support staff to handle   
   > the mundane aspects of the job though often did them myself (out of concern   
   > for getting the RIGHT result, first time.  E.g., I wire-wrapped my first   
   > CPU and the associated MPU just to be sure it got done correctly.  So,   
   > first application of power had the system up and running -- instead of   
   fussing   
   > with a technician trying to defend his mistakes).   
   >   
   >>>> There's also a difference between what is taught and what is needed in a   
   workplace.   
   >>>> I could use a soldering iron when I got my degree, but most other   
   graduates couldn't.   
   >>>   
   >>> I disagree.  Skills are easy to pick up -- how long do you think it would   
   take   
   >>> to teach someone how to make a reliable solder joint?   
   >>   
   >> As far as making a reliable solder joint is concerned I've seen many   
   outcomes.   
   >> This is from prototype testing not production.   
   >> Here are some possible outcomes.   
   >>   
   >> 1. Perfect joint.   
   >>   
   >> 2. Perfect joint after being shown that keeping your wrist on the bench   
   while you   
   >> make the joint will keep your hand steady.   
   >>   
   >> 3. Good effort but here's how to remove grime and oxide film from the   
   resistor's   
   >> legs before you solder it.   
   >>   
   >> 4. Deliberately poor joint because "I shouldn't have to do this".   
   >   
   > So, put a number on how many HOURS it would take you to learn this.   
   > Then, decide which hours of coursework you would forego to learn   
   > this skill in school.   
      
   None. But plenty of present day students seem to have to have a job as well as   
   school.   
   In my case I did partially have a job while at school because although my   
   father didn't   
   specifically offer equipment repair to people off the street, I would often   
   find a   
   non functional piece of electronics waiting for me to find out what was wrong   
   with it.   
      
   >  And, your strategy for picking up that material   
   > in the workplace?   
   >   
   > I can't think of any course that I would have sacrificed to learn   
   > some skill that I could pick up in OJT.  A colleague at an IBM division   
   > that I was working with showed me the important aspects of wirewrapping   
   > as it was directly applicable to the system I was troubleshooting for them.   
   > And, pointed me at some of the better tools available that I would later   
   > use (having purchased them for myself) to do that sort of work.   
   >   
   > I doubt I would have found such a person who would have sat down and   
   > taught me about the architecture of a B5500.  Or, the A* algorithm.   
   > Likely, none of the folks I've worked with KNOW these things!   
   >   
   >>> What is needed in the workplace is the ability to LEARN.   
   >>   
   >> Sure but if student's aren't learning during their college years then they   
   are likely   
   >> to think that that's how it will always be.   
   >   
   > It's BEFORE college.  Once you start letting kids "advance" without the   
   > requisite skill sets, they are doomed.  They won't have the foundation for   
   the   
   > next set of skills.  Which makes it unlikely that they will master THOSE.   
   > Which will hinder their progress in the Thereafter.  etc.   
   >   
   > Do kids ever "stay back" (repeat a grade) anymore?  Or, is this so abhorrent   
   > to their folks that they press the school system to let little tommy move   
   > along thinking he'll be better equipped to handle the next year's curriculum?   
   >   
   >>> Because only   
   >>> backwards looking businesses/industries worry about "today" as tomorrow   
   will   
   >>> be here momentarily.  If your new hires are only good with today's   
   skillsets,   
   >>> you'll be shit out of luck come tomorrow!   
   >>>   
   >>> Interviews (hiring processes) that rely on the applicant regurgitating some   
   >>> particular canned response are notoriously short sighted.   
   >>   
   >> I remember being asked how I would add numbers together at 10 MHz.   
   >> After giving my answer the interviewer told me that most people would say   
   >> use a microprocessor. (Not possible with a cpu back then even if you could   
   >> clock the thing at 10 MHz.)   
   >   
   > That depends on the width of the numbers (affects the propagation of carries   
   > from LSbs) and whether or not you want to have a *throughput* of 10M/s or   
   > a complete result in 100ns.  Add two 1b values in a single XOR propagation   
   > delay.  Not quite that quick with 64b values!   
   >   
   > The "DRAW" opcode in my first processor implemented the following:   
   >   ; scale the (dX,dY) vector by the associated scale factors (Ax, Ay)   
   >   x = Ax * dX   
   >   y = Ay * dY   
   >   
   >   ; determine how much each axis can be scaled up to fit under its limit   
   >   Bx = Kx / x   
   >   By = Ky / y   
   >   
   >   ; find minimum of those factors (ensures neither will exceed its limit)   
   >   G = min(Bx,By)   
   >   
   >   ; scale the "scaled vector" to approach each appropriate limit   
   >   Ox = G * x   
   >   Oy = G * y   
   >   
   >   ; reduce time by an equivalent factor   
   >   T = Kt / G   
   > in just under 2 microseconds.  In ~1980.   
   >   
   > Had I not been exposed to the B5500 et al., I would have implemented this   
   > in a more traditional, serial manner achieving perhaps 5% of the overall   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
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