From: nicolaas.vroom@pandora.be   
      
   On Sunday, 24 September 2017 22:56:52 UTC+2, Phillip Helbig (undress to reply)   
   wrote:   
   > > The LHC experiment tries to contradict SR in the sense that SR predicts   
   > > length contraction. The issue is what exactly is meant with length   
   > > contraction. Is it physical (like heat increases and cold decreases)   
   > > yes or no.   
   > > If it is physical than the LHC experiment should demonstrate this.   
      
   What I meant with this sentence is when length contraction is physical, then   
   the space between the first and last train should increase and it should be   
   physical possible to place more trains on the track.   
      
   > It is obviously not physical.   
      
   Does that mean that the space between the first and last train does not   
   increase?   
      
   > Instead of the trains running around the   
   > track, we could have two observers circling around the track---at   
   > different speeds.  What they will observe will be different.   
   That means the train are at rest?   
   When the trains are at rest a moving observers maybe will make different   
   observations i.e. measurements but that has no physical consequences.   
   > Thus,   
   > there is no physical contraction.  In SR with non-accelerated motion,   
   > there is not even a way to tell who is "really" moving.  Length   
   > contraction here is obviously an illusion.   
      
   IMO when you to study illusion, the track should have a horse   
   race shape. That means two parts should be straight. The observer   
   stays and the center of one half circle.   
   The observer sees, when the train moves away, that the train becomes   
   shorter. When the train approaches the train becomes longer.   
   The most interesting part is when the moving away train and the approaching   
   train are at the same distance from the observer. In that case the moving away   
   train becomes shorter and the approaching train becomes longer (observed).   
   All of this are illusions.   
   What SR claims (with different wording) that the moving train also becomes   
   physical shorter (along the whole track). That is the question.   
   It is either (physical) true or not.   
      
   In this discussion only one frame is considered and no moving observers are   
   involved.   
      
   Nicolaas Vroom   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)