From: julio@diegidio.name   
      
   On Saturday, 23 July 2022 at 11:49:19 UTC+2, Tom Roberts wrote:   
   > On 7/22/22 12:39 PM, Julio Di Egidio wrote:   
   > > centrifugal/centripetal [forces] exist in distinct frames of reference,   
   >   
   > It is quite clear that nature uses no frames of reference or   
   > coordinates, so every natural phenomenon MUST be   
      
   Utter nonsense: the physics is the same, the description is not.   
      
   > independent of frame or   
   > coordinates -- they are purely human constructs we use to DESCRIBE what   
   > happens. So "centrifugal force" cannot possibly be real (a natural   
   > phenomenon).   
   > > If you hop on a merry go round and don't hold yourself...   
   > > if we   
   > > actually *measure* the acceleration locally, we do find that   
   > > there is in a force, a very concrete one: so, to say that   
   > > centrifugal forces plain "do not exist" is simply wrong and   
   > > eventually misleading.   
   > You didn't completely describe what you are discussing (your "locally"   
   > is undefined). This is only "misleading" to people who ignore the   
   > context and use incomplete descriptions: Yes, if you measure the   
   > acceleration or force in the rotating coordinates you find a non-zero   
   > "centrifugal force". If you measure it in the inertial frame in which   
   > the center is at rest, you find zero force.   
      
   NO!!, now the other way round: you find that a centripetal force must   
   exist applied to the ball as the ball is NOT in uniform motion!!   
      
   And my "locally" is perfectly defined, the one who is at least confused   
   and utterly misleading is still you (and co).   
      
   > IOW: saying "centrifugal forces do not exist" is   
      
   ...utterly wrong and misleading...   
      
   Enough said.   
      
   Julio   
      
   [Moderator's note: As Julio notes, and as did I in a recent moderator's   
   note, it does seem that all has been said in this thread; it is making   
   no more progress, so let's end it.  -P.H.]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)