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|    Message 105,259 of 106,651    |
|    Alain Fournier to Alain Fournier    |
|    Re: Mars colonization    |
|    12 Mar 21 10:36:21    |
      From: alain245@videotron.ca              On Mar/11/2021 at 15:00, Alain Fournier wrote :       > On Mar/11/2021 at 14:11, JF Mezei wrote :              >> But that brings up ECLSS and food. If you have to slingshot and be       >> autonomous for another year to get back to Earth, that means that when       >> you leave earth, you leave with a hell of a lot of supplies and water.       >> And it also means you need some pretty fancy ECLSS to reclaim as much as       >> you can for water and oxygen. I have to wonder if SpaceX would take ISS       >> system designs or make their own from scratch. In later case, they are       >> a long way from having a Mars crewed mission.       >       > A mission profile with a free return (nearly free return) trajectory       > follows a path similar to a mission with a short stay on Mars. It       > wouldn't take a year. More like 7 months. But it is more energy       > expensive than a mission following a Hohmann transfer trajectory.              I thought I could entertain you a little more about orbital mechanics.              First, let's look at the base case. You want to go to Mars with the       least energy expensive trajectory. That is a Hohmann transfer orbit.        From Earth, you fire your rockets to increase your speed in the       direction of Earth's orbit around the sun. After that burn you are in an       orbit with its perihelion at Earth's orbital altitude and aphelion at       Mars' orbit. You just need to time your departure so you arrive at       aphelion when Mars happens to be at that same spot. That would be a       trajectory you would use for a probe, not for humans because the trip       from Earth to Mars takes 259 days (8.5 months). Your trip from Earth to       Mars is half of an elliptical orbit. When you want to go back to Earth,       you basically do the second half of that orbit, but once again you have       to time your departure so Earth is at the right spot when you arrive at       perihelion. So you have to stay about 9 months on Mars (or 9 months +       n*26 months).              If all you want to do on Mars is to plant the Canadian flag and come       back, the trip with the Hohmann transfer orbits takes you 26 months.       That is a little long for the five minutes it takes to actually plant       the Mexican flag. So you might want to spend a little more fuel and do       it faster.              To see how you could do the trip faster it helps to imagine what would       happen if an inhabitant of Mercury decided to go to Mars with a Hohmann       transfer orbit. The elliptical orbit with perihelion at Mercury's       altitude and aphelion at Mars' altitude has a semi-major axis of about 1       astronomical unit (more like 0.95, but to keep things simple let's       assume it is 1). That means that the orbital period of that orbit is       about 1 year. So if you are on such an elliptical orbit and you time it       so it passes near Earth, then you will pass near Earth each year. Of       course, if what you want to do is go from Earth to Mars, you don't need       to time it so it passes near Mercury, you just depart from Earth on this       trajectory at a time which is suitable so you arrive near Mars at       aphelion. Now we know that on an elliptical orbit you have higher speed       near periapsis and slower speed near apoapsis. So between Earth and       Mars, your angular rate will be less than the average rate over a       complete orbit of one revolution per year. So if you go to Mars and then       try to come immediately back with such a trajectory, when you will reach       Earth's orbit, Earth will be farther away and you won't like that.              What you want to do is the opposite of an Hohmann transfer orbit from       Mercury. Imagine this time that you leave Earth on a Hohmann transfer       orbit for Neptune. In the lower part of the orbit (e.g. between Earth       and Mars) your angular rate will be higher than that of Earth. So if you       go to Mars with such a trajectory, plant the Kazakh flag (for Make       Benefit Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan) and immediately come back to       Earth with a trajectory again with periapsis at Earth orbit and apoapsis       at Neptune orbit, then you will get to Earth orbit in front of Earth,       since your angular rate is higher than that of Earth. You can easily       solve that problem by staying on Mars for a while after having planted       the flag of China. Since Mars' orbital angular rate is lower than that       of Earth, Earth will catch up during your stay. The problem with that is       that you spent enough fuel to reach Neptune just to get to Mars. So if       you want to stay only five minutes on Mars to plant the flag of       Zimbabwe, you choose a transfer orbit with an apoapsis at X, where X is       a distance from the sun somewhere between Mars (which would return you       behind Earth) and Neptune (which would return you in front of Earth)       such that you return at Earth (X is in fact somewhere in the asteroid belt).              If you want to go even faster than that, you can choose the trajectory       of an orbit with periapsis lower than Earth and apoapsis higher than X       mentioned above. But that will cost you in delta-V.              Now, about the free return trajectory if you decide that you don't       really want to plant the flag of [choose your country here] on Mars.       When you reach Mars, you have the right speed to return to Earth, your       only problem is that you are not going in the right direction. But by       passing by Mars, gravity will change your direction, you just need to       properly choose at what altitude you do your Mars flyby.                     Alain Fournier              --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05        * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)    |
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