XPost: comp.theory, sci.math, comp.ai.philosophy   
   From: polcott333@gmail.com   
      
   On 12/23/2025 7:50 PM, Richard Damon wrote:   
   > On 12/23/25 7:08 PM, olcott wrote:   
   >> On 12/23/2025 11:48 AM, Richard Damon wrote:   
   >>> On 12/23/25 12:24 PM, olcott wrote:   
   >>>> On 12/23/2025 10:59 AM, Richard Damon wrote:   
   >>>>> On 12/23/25 11:43 AM, olcott wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 12/23/2025 9:34 AM, olcott wrote:   
   >>>>>>> A Turing-machine decider is a Turing machine D that   
   >>>>>>> computes a total function D : Σ∗ → {Accept,Reject},   
   >>>>>>> where Σ∗ is the set of all finite strings over the   
   >>>>>>> input alphabet. That is:   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> 1. Totality: For every finite string input w ∈ Σ∗,   
   >>>>>>> D halts and outputs either Accept or Reject.   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> 2. Decision basis: Each input string is evaluated   
   >>>>>>> according to one of two types of properties:   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>    (a) Syntactic property: a property of the input   
   >>>>>>>    string itself, such as containing a particular   
   >>>>>>>    substring or satisfying a structural pattern.   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>    (b) Semantic property: a property of the sequence of   
   >>>>>>>    computational steps explicitly encoded by the input   
   >>>>>>>    string, i.e., the behavior that the input itself   
   >>>>>>>    specifies when interpreted as a machine description.   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> (b) Semantic property: This only applies to the subset   
   >>>>>> of finite strings that are valid machine descriptions   
   >>>>>> a property of the sequence of computational steps explicitly   
   >>>>>> encoded by the input string, i.e., the behavior that the   
   >>>>>> input itself specifies.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Right, so why does that not apply to the encoding you gave it to   
   >>>>> describe P?   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> If that input DOESN't encode the needed steps, you didn't give it   
   >>>>> the right encoding.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>   
   >>>> The common meaning of the term "describe" does   
   >>>> not mean specifies an exactly sequence of steps.   
   >>>   
   >>> But the term-of-art does.   
   >>>   
   >>   
   >> Because is does not directly say that it specifies   
   >> an exact sequence of steps: experts in the field   
   >> of the theory of computation totally miss the very   
   >> subtle nuance THAT CHANGES EVERYTHING.   
   >   
   > No, that is the meaning of describe as the term-of-art.   
   >   
   > It needs to be a complete description of the algorithm used by the   
   > machine, and that DOES describe, when combined with the input to that   
   > machine, the exact sequence of steps the machine will do.   
   >   
   > Did you not claim that the x86 instructions of a program are a suitable   
   > encoding for the input?   
   >   
   >>   
   >>> I guess you don't understand how word meaning works.   
   >>>   
   >>>>   
   >>>> (b) Semantic property: This only applies to the subset   
   >>>> of finite strings that are valid machine descriptions   
   >>>> a property of the sequence of computational steps explicitly   
   >>>> encoded by the input string, i.e., the behavior that the   
   >>>> input itself specifies.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Every tiny nuance of meaning of every single word   
   >>>> is required.   
   >>>>   
   >>>   
   >>> Right, which EXPLICITLY says that the behavior of the machine encoded   
   >>> (which is another term for describing) is a valid criteria that a   
   >>> decider must be able to be asked.   
   >>>   
   >>> All you are doing is showing your utter stupidity.   
   >>>   
   >>>   
   >>   
   >> It defines P simulated by H as the correct answer.   
   >   
   >   
   > Nope, where does it say that?   
   >   
   > It says the computational steps encoded in the input string. That would   
   > be the UTM processing of the string.   
   >   
      
   Maybe you fundamentally cannot pay very close   
   attention. On the other hand   
      
   Individuals with Asperger syndrome often   
   exhibit exceptional focus and persistence   
   when pursuing their interests or tasks.   
      
   Which has not been renamed to a kind of   
   attention deficit by the morons in charge.   
      
   I have hyper focused attention you have lack of   
   sufficient attention.   
      
   The key solution for this (if one exists) is for   
   you to read this over and over again until you   
   can directly see that nothing like the idea of   
   a UTM or direct execution is ever mentioned or   
   implied.   
      
   A Turing-machine decider is a Turing machine D that   
   computes a total function D :  Σ∗ → {Accept,Reject},   
   where Σ∗ is the set of all finite strings over the   
   input alphabet. That is:   
      
   1. Totality: For every finite string input w ∈ Σ∗,   
   D halts and outputs either Accept or Reject.   
      
   2. Decision basis: Each input string is evaluated   
   according to one of two types of properties:   
      
   (a) Syntactic property: a property of the input   
   string itself, such as containing a particular   
   substring or satisfying a structural pattern.   
      
   (b) Semantic property: a property of the sequence of   
   computational steps explicitly encoded by the input   
   string, i.e., the behavior that the input itself   
   specifies when interpreted as a machine description.   
      
   The decider outputs Accept if the corresponding property   
   holds for the input and Reject otherwise.   
      
      
   --   
   Copyright 2025 Olcott

   
      
   My 28 year goal has been to make 
   
   "true on the basis of meaning expressed in language"
   
   reliably computable.

   
      
   This required establishing a new foundation
   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)