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From: acoustic@panix.com
In article <87a8xeq31k.fsf@wintersun.localdomain>,
jdeluise wrote:
>acoustic@panix.com (lo yeeOn) writes:
>
>>
>> Of course, if the Tsarnaev brothers had not built their IEDs and
>> detonated them at the Marathon, those who lost their limbs would still
>> have their limbs and those who were killed would be alive. But the
>> chain of causality ultimately goes back to our rulers, who have little
>> regard for lives, other their own.
>
>They indiscriminately killed and maimed scores of people, without any
>sort of message or purpose... had they gotten away with it we would
>never known why it was done. This had nothing to do with any of the
>issues you claim, these brothers were simply maladjusted losers.
Now, sir, when it comes to the issue of killing "indiscriminately",
how should we compare its extent (using IEDs) with that of Hiroshima
and Nagasaki (using the world's only two atom bombs that existed at
the time) or with the hundreds of thousands of excess deaths in Iraq,
using the world's most advanced missiles and missile-delivery systems
today, and white phosphor, and the biggest bombs that could be carried
over thousands of miles and dropped from a stealth plane in the death
of night?
You say the Tsarnaev brothers' act did not have "any sort of message
or purpose..."! What sort of message or purpose was the nuking of
Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the rape of Iraq?
Of course, all of these terrorist acts, whether carried out by two
brothers or by state-sponsored machineries, have purposes and carry
messages.
If the Tsarnaev brothers' act were without purpose, the trial would
have declared that they were deranged, I am sure!
The truth is, without so many words, the brothers were expressing
their repugnance of the so-called "War on Terror" waged against
innocent people around the world, many of them have been Muslims,
people whom the brothers naturally felt dear to.
The "War on Terror" is so false and so pretentious. Who has the right
to kill just because we have the guns and can say anything to justify
what we do?
"Vengeance is mine," Jehovah said; don't you remember?
Islam is closely modelled after the Judeo-Christian Bible, however
discomfortable a truth that is for those of us who are brought up as
Christians but who are oblivious of their responsibility for all the
killings that have been committed in the Middle East and in Africa in
our names.
What the Tsarnaev brothers were doing were dead-ended, stupid stuff,
but what they did were not without purpose or a message. Since sooner
or later they would have been discovered, one way or another, and even
if they weren't, the motive behind their acts would have been, it's
inconceivable that we would not have known what had struck, as you
claimed.
jdeluise:
>had they gotten away with it we would never known why it was done.
The truth never lies far.
It has always been clear that our new millennium wars are behind the
radicalization of many youths in the United States as well as in
France and England, among other European countries. It is just that
our government does not want the American people to see that it itself
is ultimately the cause of all these blowbacks.
They've used torture and long jail sentences to shut up people like
Brad Manning, "Johnny Taliban" Walker, and now Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.
And they always use the term "conspiracy theories" in attempt to gloss
over any suggestion that the government is behind the largest scale of
slaughter of innocent people we have seen during the last two decades
and that is Tsarnaev's whole life time so far.
Why should we or the Tsarnaev brothers accept the deaths of those
killed by our bombs and missiles, such as those revealed by Brad
Manning, more than they intended to kill and did kill with their IEDs?
Isn't the life of a journalist with an Arabic origin just as precious
as anyone harmed by the brothers at the Boston Marathon? Who is to
say that it is not? In particular, who can say that the morals of the
brothers was just corrupted by themselves, as you claimed?
To the contrary, most educated people should be able to draw the
conclusion that the dramatic transformation of these two from a couple
of kind-hearted souls to a couple of terrorists who are destined to be
losers _must necessarily_ have a cause.
To deny that there could have a causal relationship between our
government's continuing callous action against defenseless people
under the patently dishonest banner of "war on terror" - going after
one country before we finish with another - is transparently dishonest
on the individual's part in itself.
Murder is by definition intentional conduct. I can't imagine the
murders that George W Bush, Obama, or Truman have committed to be any
more grand or acceptable. I can't imagine anyone concluding that the
killings committed by our presidents are not senseless. No human has
the right to take away another human's life. The murder in sheer
numbers by our presidents is not only senseless but in my personal
view unforgivable. By my logic, therefore, that if we can have the
heart to forgive our presidents, we ought to be able to forgive the
small fry too.
The Lord says "Vengeance is mine". Who has the license to kill?
Yet, our government is saying: "Forget what we do, just punish the
little fry. That guy, yes, that surviving creep of the Tsarnaev
brothers must die, and die as soon as possible!"
So the trial drama becomes one which is saying: While George W Bush
and Obama can go scot-free, that "mal-adjusted Chechen" must pay with
the last pound of his stinking flesh.
Right? That's your assessment, right, jdeluise?
Our government wants young Tsarnaev dead so much that it is now
seeking to prevent a nun from testifying on behalf of those who
champion "no execution of another human in the name of the American
people"!
So what is it afraid of? That the American people finally remember
that they are a country of Christians, meaning followers of Jesus
Christ's teaching, and therefore should use this moment to question
the legitimacy and morality of our "War on Terror"?
lo yeeOn
>It was senseless murder, nothing more grand than that. They simply
>were attracted to something they felt gave them purpose and a
>"license" to kill.
Excerpt from the Christian Science Monitor:
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/USA-Update/2015/0508/Why-Tsarnaev
prosecutors-want-to-keep-Catholic-nun-off-the-stand
As the team of lawyers defending Boston Marathon bomber Dzhokhar
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* Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)
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