From: SolomonW@citi.com   
      
   On Sat, 16 Nov 2019 09:38:52 -0800 (PST), Oh so rich & successful JTEM   
   wrote:   
      
   >  SolomonW wrote:   
   >   
   >> All you need is a food surplus, and of course water, the population will   
   >> grow and soon a culture and civilization will form.   
   >   
   > Yes.   
   >   
   > I guess there is an argument to be made that surplus requires adaptations   
   > (innovations) in order to store the surplus... guard the surplus...   
   > interactions in order to trade the surplus...   
   >   
   > It probably even leads to war:  "They have TONS of wheat!  Let's go   
   > conquer them!"   
   >   
   > And of course even the dumbest conquerers are eventually going to figure   
   > out that they don't want to kill the surplus holders, they want them alive,   
   > continuously producing surplus and handing it over like good vassals...   
   >   
   > Math/writing to keep track of the surplus and handed it over?   
   >   
   > Tools to make that surplus easier?   
      
   Yes this too.   
      
      
   My argument was a bit lower down, just put say a million people together   
   and a culture/civilization will form.   
      
   >   
   > Irrigation? So there's water management right there...   
      
   Most of the early civilizations were river based. Irrigation was very   
   important and it consumed a major chunk of society.   
      
      
   >   
   > So, yeah, "Surplus" comes with a poop ton of baggage.   
   >   
   > "Wicked lots."   
   >   
   >   
   >   
   >   
   >   
   > -- --   
   >   
   > https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/189091429143   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)