XPost: alt.atheism, alt.agnosticism, sci.skeptic
XPost: alt.christnet
From: bruces42@hotmail.com
On 06/30/2014 05:00 PM, bilgat@m.nu wrote:
> On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 18:47:04 -0600, BruceS
> wrote:
>
>> On 06/29/2014 06:51 AM, bilgat@m.nu wrote:
>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2014 18:54:23 -0600, BruceS
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 06/26/2014 01:06 PM, bilgat@m.nu wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 26 Jun 2014 19:19:28 +1000, felix_unger
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 25-June-2014 2:02 AM, bilgat@m.nu wrote:
>>>>>>> once a person is an atheist that person will always be an atheist.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> untrue
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess you know because you are an atheist?
>>>>>
>>>>> YOU HAVE NO IDEA you little fucking gimp. You dont know what it is
>>>>> like to know the truth. You dont know what it is like to realize that
>>>>> you have been lied to by most people for your entire life. You dont
>>>>> know what it is like then the people come to your door trying to sell
>>>>> god and you cant help but feel so sorry for them for being such
>>>>> idiots.
>>>>>
>>>>> No you will never know what it is like because your mind wiill never
>>>>> be opend to what the world is really like. You will never know because
>>>>> your brain just is not able to understand the truth
>>>>
>>>> I have to agree with Felix on this one. I've known atheists who became
>>>> religious, nearly always Christian. I had a HS friend who was no more
>>>> interested in invisible sky monkeys than I was; more focused on scoring
>>>> some weed and getting high. After we graduated and went our separate
>>>> ways, he seemed to keep "the faith" for a while, but then one vacation
>>>> he had become "saved" and talked about little but Jesus
>>>
>>> just because a person is not a practicing theist does not make them
>>> atheist or agnostic even. If a person can not say with 100% clarity
>>> that they know that there is no god that there will never be a god and
>>> there has never been a god, then that person is NOT an atheist.
>>
>> You seem to be arguing for theists' definition of "atheist". Under that
>> definition, I'm not an atheist, but I'm not sure what you'd call me. I
>> define myself as an atheist because I have no belief in any gods.
>
> so are you trying to say that you can not state that there is no god
> at all? if you can not say that then no you are not an atheist, at
> least not in my opinion. You have said that you have no "belief in
> god", but do you "know" that god does not exist.
You appear to completely fail to understand the difference between not
believing in A and firmly believing in !A. There's a huge difference,
represented by a large population. If you have a definite belief in !A,
there's even a burden of proof on you to provide evidence for !A. Your
opinion of the nature of atheism is overly limited.
> And every theist has in thier own mind what atheist means but when it
> comes down to it the meaning is simple. Atheist = no gods. and that is
> it. You can further define it as a lack of belief in any gods.
> However you have stated you have no belief in gods so that would mean
> you are an atheist. So why cant you say "there are no gods"?
>
> saying you have no belief is the exact same thing
No, it isn't.
>>> That person either has fears that there may actually be a heaven and a
>>> hell or that person is just to embarassed to say they believe or
>>> perhaps that person just wants attnetion so they act like they are
>>> atheist or agnostic even just to have thier desires met
>>
>> No to all of that. I have no fear of magical places for living after
>> death, or anything like that, and am not at all embarrassed to say I
>> have no firm beliefs regarding magic, including gods. I lack belief in
>> gods. In my opinion, that makes me an atheist. If I wanted attention,
>> I'd do better by pretending to belief.
>>
>>> . If they fear the heaven or hell thing then there are a closet theist
>>> and they actually do have a belief in a god purely out of fear,
>>> chances are though they will never admit that
>>
>> You seem to make a lot of assumptions about the beliefs and motives of
>> other people. I suggest that you do so at great risk of being wrong
>> most of the time.
>
> Not making assumptions, just stating observations.
Your "observations" appear to be based on naive assumptions about things
you cannot know, such as the motivations and beliefs of others.
>>>> At first I
>>>> thought he was pulling my leg, but he was serious. A few months later
>>>> he had regained his sense, but later still had a relapse. He's not the
>>>> only one I've known to suddenly embrace irrationality and superstition,
>>>> just the one who came to mind first. Many people who go through life as
>>>> atheists suddenly start one or another form of "spiritualism" when faced
>>>> with their own mortality. I've been appalled at the mental lapses shown
>>>> merely from taking an abstract reality and bringing it to the
>>>
>>> That is a prime example of a closet theist. Those kind of people even
>>> like to call themselves agnostic for example "%" that comes here is
>>> like that. After it is all said and done though he is a theist purely
>>> our of fear and lack of education or perhaps even the wrong kind of
>>> education
>>>
>>> If a person has enough forethough so say GOD DOES NOT EXIST and know
>>> alll the reasons why then that person is an atheist. IF a person says
>>> they are atheist just ask them why and if they can not give you a
>>> rather detailed answer then chances are that person is not an atheist
>>
>> You have a dictionary failure.
>
> why would you say that? I dont understand how that relates to if a
> person is artheist or not.
Quite simply, the fact that someone is an atheist does not imply that
that person has some set of reasons, acceptable to a misinformed and
narrow-minded observer, for being an atheist. It doesn't even imply
that he is sure there are no gods, simply that he does not believe there
to be any.
> Tell me bruce Why are you an atheist?
I've said it before, but I'll say it again. Atheism is the default
condition for a sensible, logical person in the absence of any objective
evidence for one or more gods. As I have never seen any such evidence,
I remain an atheist. Various theists claim to have evidence for their
particular god, but that evidence consistently turns out to be no
evidence for the god at all, but rather evidence for their fellow
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