XPost: alt.philosophy.taoism, alt.philosophy.zen   
   From: wudao@wuji.net   
      
   Ummmmmmm wrote:   
   > {:-]))) wrote:   
   >>   
   >> One might wonder why such a true self would post here,   
   >> if all true selves are perfect, unsulliable, full of light, free, etc.   
   >> if there would be any point, on earth, or elsewhere.   
   >   
   >You misunderstand me.   
      
   I tend to misunderstand most everyone in ways.   
      
   >I'm not pretending to be any of those things.   
      
   I wonder at times about Tang, pretending not to be   
   what he claims that is he isn't in his disclaimers.   
      
   Perhaps you are both the same. And everything is the same.   
   Or similar if not the same. In some different ways.   
      
   >What i call "the true self" is not a vesture, or set of ceremonial   
   >robes, for the ego to strut around in.   
   >   
   >The way some people pretend to be Taoists, or Zennists, or polymath   
   >scholars.   
      
   Perhaps they are not pretending.   
   Maybe their true selves are expressing themselves.   
      
   But, one sees them thru a filter.   
   A mirror of sorts. Maybe.   
      
   >It's not a description of an ideal person, or a saint or a sage.   
   >   
   >It's a Presence to be enjoyed, wondered at, delighted in.   
   >The Presence in the Present.   
      
   Some true selves play for keeps. Very serious. Involved. Totally.   
      
   >It doesn't act.   
      
   Then it can't play.   
   Unless, if it does, wu-wei.   
      
   > It doesn't go anywhere. It's the still point of the   
   >turning world.It can be heard, seen, tasted, felt.   
   >It's in every human being.   
      
   Then it's different from every human being.   
   Being different, no one is one's true self.   
      
   Just as Tang might say what all spiritual masters all say,   
   so you may say what is in every human being.   
      
   Not having met every human being, I would presume   
   that you have not met them all either, just as Tang has not   
   met every spiritual master and yet, eclectics and syncretists   
   might all be said to be the same in various ways.   
      
   They might see Taoism as being the same as all other systems.   
   Or, if they see differences, those differences are ignored   
   as if they made no difference, to every human being.   
      
   I've heard Tao is in all things.   
   And I've heard of the center to be held fast to.   
   I've heard of emptiness, that is the usefulness of uselessness.   
      
   Zhenren may enter a picture.   
   Along with Wuji. In a Taoist paradigm.   
      
   >To know it is to know that all histories, dharmas, scriptures, dogmas,   
   >rituals, intellectual arguments about the nature of reality, are   
   >irrelevant. They all try to build bridges between the past and the   
   >future. The true self exists only in the present.   
      
   Some say Tao is God, and they know it   
   in the same way you know all histories, dharmas, scriptures, dogmas,   
   rituals, intellectual arguments about the nature of reality, are   
   irrelevant. They try to build bridges between all systems   
   of thought and know how their true self is the same   
   as every other true self.   
      
   Every body has a center   
   of gravity. But it isn't serious. Every one has   
   a center of balance, which one might lose at times.   
      
   >It's beyond thought, and beyond imagination - and it's very, very real.   
      
   That might be what Tang says all spiritual masters say.   
   Or maybe he is pointing to something else. Some other Way.   
      
   To say one has a true self is something some say.   
   If so, one may wonder who or what is it that has it.   
      
   >Because it's in everyone, it can be known by anyone.   
      
   If it's in everyone, then no one is it.   
   It's different from everyone. If so, then who or what one is   
   might be a question that could be asked of one who knows   
   how one has a true self that is within one and everyone.   
      
   > There are no   
   >barriers of race, sex, belief, education, economic status, age.   
   >   
   >The point of posting here is not to tell you anything new, but to remind   
   >you of something you may have forgotten.   
   >You knew it way back then, when life was fun.   
      
   My life is unusually fun, at times.   
   Usually every day. Especially at three in the morning.   
      
   I tend to be reminded of it every time I post here   
   after reading what everyone has posted here.   
      
   The games here vary in various ways. Some point to Tao.   
   Some say everyone is the same in some way, or Way.   
   Some may say each is the Way, or something else.   
      
   Some might say one has the Way.   
   Or one has a Way. That it's all the same Way.   
      
   What and how everyone says what everyone says   
   tends to be a ping, a sounding board on a board   
   full of pings, and sometimes a pong or two.   
      
   >> Unless, the one that has a true self   
   >> is not the true self but something else.   
   >>   
   >> Something that has but not is.   
      
   If someone had a net, it might be full of holes.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)