XPost: alt.philosophy.taoism, alt.buddha.short.fat.guy, alt.philosophy.zen   
   From: meanmrmustard@gmail.com   
      
   "noname"  wrote in message news:o09e38$f79$5@dont-email.me...   
   >   
   > dagnabit  wrote:   
   > > "brian mitchell"  wrote in message   
   > > news:re0f2c98d4lrgp4dbj6lf3l14fg1ka743t@4ax.com...   
   > >>   
   > >> "Kitty P" wrote:   
   > >>   
   > >>>   
   > >>>   
   > >>> "brian mitchell"  wrote in message   
   > >>> news:rgvc2cp8busdrng14sng534clu6ph6c0h6@4ax.com...   
   > >>>   
   > >>> noname wrote:   
   > >>>   
   > >>>> brian mitchell  wrote:   
   > >>>>> noname wrote:   
   > >>>>>   
   > >>>>>> brian mitchell  wrote:   
   > >>>>>>   
   > >>>>>>   
   > >>>>>>> ..., so much as the total incapacity of   
   > >>>>>>> thought to approach that which begins where thought ends.   
   > >>>>>>   
   > >>>>>> Thought can eliminate the places it isn't...   
   > >>>>>   
   > >>>>> Sounds contradictory. Can you elaborate?   
   > >>>>>   
   > >>>>   
   > >>>> What good will it do for me to speak of that about which too much is   
   > >>>> already spoken to no effect?   
   > >>>>   
   > >>>> If you want to go to the place where there thought transcends itself,   
   > >>>> you   
   > >>>> can start by eliminating all the places where it doesn't transcend   
   > >>>> itself...   
   > >>>   
   > >>> It's not real to me that thought can transcend itself, so perhaps you   
   > >>> have a different notion of what thought is than I do. Can you say what   
   > >>> thought is --without going into the various things it does? How does   
   > >>> it transcend itself?   
   > >>> ______________________________   
   > >>>   
   > >>> The only time I can stop thought is when meditating. My ex husband was   
   > >>> great   
   > >>> at it with alcohol.  I would love to know how to magically transcend   
   > >>> it   
   > >>> by   
   > >>> what? More thought?  Really am interested in knowing..   
   > >>   
   > >> It's often stated that by observing thought one comes to perceive the   
   > >> silence between thoughts but I've not (yet?) had that experience. What   
   > >> I've found is that even when the chatter dies down there is still an   
   > >> ever-present consciousness of self, which is simply a wordless   
   > >> thought.   
   > >   
   > > the wordless I am feeling is the beginning of intuitive apperception   
   > > and from there more density can be relinquished until essence of   
   > > mind is perceived and the state prior to concepts is noticed, so to   
   > > speak.   
   > >   
   > >   
   > >   
   > >   
   > >   
   >   
   > Another way to see it is that the thinker keeps on thinking because a   
   > cold-boot takes too long, but once you remember how it's supposed to be   
   > working to help you, you can send it off to count sand and get some peace   
   > and quiet for a change.  The thinker doesn't go away as far as I can tell,   
   > just because it's out of the way for a while doesn't mean it's   
   > disappeared.   
   >  The fact that it continues to chatter is only relevant while you listen   
   > to   
   > it, and if you tell it to stop flattering you maybe it will.  If it's   
   > doing   
   > its job, it certainly should.  imo.   
      
   seeing thinking-ness as a thinker simply puts a noun   
   on a process that may be better described as a verb.   
   nouns are said to be a person, place or thing yet these   
   are also in process but may appear to be more static   
   than other verb descriptions. man-made grammar   
   distinctions may add unnecessary conceptual and   
   perceptual meaning where there is none.   
      
   walking a personalization path to noun addendums may   
   just be another veil in conceptual negotiation.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)