Forums before death by AOL, social media and spammers... "We can't have nice things"
|    talk.religion.newage    |    Esoteric and minority religions & philos    |    9,163 messages    |
[   << oldest   |   < older   |   list   |   newer >   |   newest >>   ]
|    Message 7,419 of 9,163    |
|    ibshambat@gmail.com to All    |
|    Open letter to James Randi    |
|    16 Sep 14 18:06:28    |
      Dear Mr. Randi:              You've made a name for yourself by preaching that telepathy, astrology, and       even mainstream religion, are for kooks and idiots. By this definition, the       bulk of humanity are kooks and idiots, because most people have one or another       kind of spiritual        beliefs. I find this to be a very arrogant stance to take.              Why do people have spiritual beliefs? The line of some is that it's because of       how they were raised; but how did these beliefs occasion in the first place,       and why do we see people now, who were raised without any religious beliefs       whatsoever, join        Christianity or Islam? Christianity, for one, began at the time when there was       a lot of knowledge. The Roman Empire had great engineers, excellent doctors       and fine mathematicians. How did this belief spread? The people at the time       were definitely not        idiots, nor were they kooks. There must have been a good reason why this       happened.              In more recent times, the anti-spiritual line has been proven wrong by many       people having very real spiritual experiences, and many of them were due       neither to schizophrenia nor to drugs. Sure you can call this "anecdotal       evidence." What is anecdotal        evidence? It is people's stated experiences. It may be anecdotal to you, but       it's not anecdotal to people to whom it happens. To them, it is reality.              I am an educated person, and I started being against everything        superstitious." My experiences proved me wrong. Once again, you may call this       anecdotal; but it's not anecdotal to me.              In fact I've known any number of in-good-faith scientists and highly educated       professionals who've had very real spiritual experiences and would tell you       about this. Do you think you, not being a scientist, know more than       scientists? I think not. Most of        your followers aren't scientists either. That is because a real scientist has       an open worldview and would recognize things as real even if they don't fit       into the paradigm of his work.              As someone who knows a number of very accomplished metaphysicians, I can say       that the experiment that you have designed has a flaw in it. Not even the most       skillful psychic can reliably reproduce a one in a million result. That there       have been people        qualifying for the experiment by reproducing a one in a thousand result, shows       the wrongness of your claims that all this is nonsense. A one in a thousand       result is quite good.              There is another aspect of this situation that I want to talk to you about. It       may sound kooky, but then again you've studied such things as well. I have       known any number of people who've been into mysticism or the occult, who then       converted to        Christianity. Of course they kept the knowledge that they had gained and have       been using it on behalf of Christianity. Let me ask you a simple question:              What would keep you from using your knowledge of the occult to jinx the       results of the experiment?              As someone with some knowledge of the subject, I can say right off hand that       intuition can be a very fragile mechanism. In many situations it can be very       easy to sabotage it; and I've known any number of people who did just that. So       what would keep you        from, consciously or unconsciously, sabotaging this mechanism in the people       who go for your experiment?              Yes, I know, I sound like a kook. But you're a magician, so that makes the two       of us.              Are there people who take mystical ideas to wrongful directions? Of course       there are. But that does not mean that everyone with mystical ideas or       mystical knowledge use these things for ill, nor are all of them kooks. I've       known any number of people who'       ve helped any number of others with use of mystical knowledge. What have you       been doing to help people lately?              Surely you would say, deconstructing mystical nonsense. Once again, it's not       nonsense to people who've had these experiences; and calling it anedotal does       nothing for these people. What you have really done is empower thugs, who have       been going around        maliciously attacking people who've had spiritual experiences or have interest       in spiritual phenomena. And that is not any kind of virtue, nor is it any kind       of an accomplishment.               I believe in taking problems to their source, and you are the source of a very       real problem. The movement that you have started has been exceptionally       malicious, and these people think that they understand the facts of the       universe when they are not        even scientists and even regard the scientists who've had spiritual       experiences as kooks. Their assumption that nothing spiritual can exist, and       that everyone with spiritual experiences is a kook or an idiot, leads them to       behave in an extremely vicious        and bullying manner, going as far as telling a 15-year-old girl that she is       mentally defective. This is the influence that you have had in the world.              Perhaps as the leader of this movement you would inform your followers to cool       it; but I do not expect you to do such a thing. I expect you to continue with       your hypocritical and arrogant project of portraying the bulk of humanity as       kooks and idiots.        Of course this is a lot less for you than it is for people who stand to be       vulnerable to the attacks you've been launching. And I hope that these people       use these arguments against your followers and anyone affiliated with you.              --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05        * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)    |
[   << oldest   |   < older   |   list   |   newer >   |   newest >>   ]
(c) 1994, bbs@darkrealms.ca