From: rokimoto557@gmail.com   
      
   On 12/30/2025 5:51 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   > On 31/12/2025 3:52 am, Martin Harran wrote:   
   >> On Tue, 16 Dec 2025 23:22:43 +1100, MarkE  wrote:   
   >>   
   >>> On 16/12/2025 1:23 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>> On 12/15/25 4:53 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>> Larry Moran offers this analysis:   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> "...A small number of these neutral mutations will become fixed in the   
   >>>>> population and it's these fixed mutations that produce most of the   
   >>>>> changes in the genome of evolving populations. According to the   
   >>>>> neutral theory of population genetics, the number of fixed neutral   
   >>>>> mutations corresponds to the mutation rate. Thus, in every evolving   
   >>>>> population there will be 100 new fixed mutations per generation. This   
   >>>>> means that fixation of 22 million mutations would take 220,000   
   >>>>> generations. The average generation time of humans and chimps is 27.5   
   >>>>> years so this corresponds to about 6 million years. That's close to   
   >>>>> the time that humans and chimps diverged according to the fossil   
   >>>>> record. What this means is that evolutionary theory is able to explain   
   >>>>> the differences in the human genome—it has explanatory power."   
   >>>>> https://sandwalk.blogspot.com/2025/12/how-many-regulatory-sites-in-   
   >>>>> human.html   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> However, chimp to human evolution involves major (profound)   
   >>>>> adaptations, including:   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> - Bipedalism and capacity for long-distance walking and endurance   
   >>>>> running: short, broad pelvis; S-shaped spine; long legs relative to   
   >>>>> arms; arched feet with non-opposable big toe.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> - Cognitive capacity increase: larger cranial capacity; dramatically   
   >>>>> expanded neocortex; highly developed prefrontal cortex; these produce:   
   >>>>> abstract reasoning; symbolic language; long-term planning;   
   >>>>> mathematics, music, art; large cooperative societies; etc.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> - Other physiology: extended childhood and adolescence; long lifespan;   
   >>>>> high energy investment in brain development; reduced muscle mass   
   >>>>> relative to body size; craniofacial morphology supporting speech   
   >>>>> articulation and dietary flexibility; precision hand grip and fine   
   >>>>> motor control.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> How many non-neutral adaptive mutations (in fact, highly adaptive,   
   >>>>> complex and coordinated suites of mutations) are required, over and   
   >>>>> above the estimated neutral/near-neutral mutations, to produce these   
   >>>>> adaptations, and how are these accounted for in the time available?   
   >>>>>   
   >>>> How many adaptive mutations? A few thousand, perhaps. Coordinated   
   >>>> suites? Why would that be necessary? And how they would be accounted   
   >>>> for   
   >>>> is simple: you should understand that a number of mutations many orders   
   >>>> of magnitude greater than the ones that eventually became fixed would   
   >>>> have happened during human evolution. The ones that were advantageous   
   >>>> were therefore a small sample of a much larger number than you are   
   >>>> imagining here.   
   >>>>   
   >>>   
   >>> Here's your dilemma:   
   >>>   
   >>> 1. The human brain is the most complex object in the known universe*   
   >>>   
   >>> 2. Chimps are uncannily intelligent, but human intelligence is on   
   >>> another level: abstract reasoning; symbolic language; long-term   
   >>> planning; mathematics, music, art; large cooperative societies; etc   
   >>>   
   >>> 3. Therefore, the evolution of the human brain and human intelligence   
   >>> from a chimp requires either:   
   >>>   
   >>> (a) a very large increase in functional complexity; or   
   >>>   
   >>> (b) the activation of largely pre-existing, latent capacity   
   >>>   
   >>> If (a), then the generation of large amounts of new functional   
   >>> complexity must be driven by adaptation (neutral drift without strong   
   >>> selection cannot refine and ratchet up functional complexity);   
   >>> therefore, the number of adaptive mutations required in this case would   
   >>> be much, much more than "A few thousand".   
   >>>   
   >>> Larry Moran has taken most of the available mutations off the table in   
   >>> declaring them neutral or near-neutral, and in doing so has left   
   >>> dramatically too few adaptive mutations to do the necessary heavy   
   >>> lifting*   
   >>>   
   >>> If (b), then you've only shifted the problem, and raised this question:   
   >>> how then did chimp brains acquire this latent capacity, since by   
   >>> definition it has not previously been activated and expressed, and   
   >>> therefore has not been selectable and built up over time.   
   >>>   
   >>> Moreover, this option is something like suggesting that an Apple M5   
   >>> processor can be activated from an Intel Pentium processor with "a few   
   >>> thousand gates of tweaking", or that GPT 1.0 plus "a few thousand lines   
   >>> of code" could give you GPT 5.   
   >>   
   >> What is *your* solution to this dilemma? It seem to me you have two   
   >> possibilities:   
   >>   
   >> #1   
   >> God tweaked the existing systems in a common ancestor of man and   
   >> chimps so that a human  descendant would eventually appear.   
   >>   
   >> #2   
   >> God directly created man as a brand new species but acting as a   
      
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