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   talk.origins      Evolution versus creationism (sometimes      142,602 messages   

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   Message 142,412 of 142,602   
   MarkE to MarkE   
   Re: Chimp to human evolution - Sandwalk    
   05 Feb 26 12:33:00   
   
   From: me22over7@gmail.com   
      
   On 5/02/2026 12:16 pm, MarkE wrote:   
   > On 5/02/2026 5:50 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >> On 2/4/26 3:59 AM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>> On 4/02/2026 10:32 pm, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>> On 3/02/2026 2:14 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>> On 2/2/26 6:05 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 3/02/2026 12:11 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>> On 2/1/26 6:02 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>> On 2/02/2026 3:44 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>> On 1/31/26 10:18 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>> On 1/02/2026 9:11 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/31/26 1:58 AM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> On 31/01/2026 2:37 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/30/26 5:26 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 31/01/2026 5:56 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/29/26 9:54 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 30/01/2026 3:17 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/29/26 7:57 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 30/01/2026 2:10 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/29/26 6:40 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 30/01/2026 12:50 pm, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/29/26 5:31 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 30/01/2026 11:20 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/29/26 3:37 AM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 27/01/2026 11:41 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/24/26 3:28 AM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 24/01/2026 1:54 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/22/26 6:15 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 23/01/2026 1:31 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/21/26 9:18 PM, MarkE wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 22/01/2026 3:22 am, John Harshman wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ...   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now if you're interested in what makes an   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> organism, without much regard for what kind   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of organism, you have a point that the ovum   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has various bits that must be in place in   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> order to get the process of development   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> going, and that there are many interactions   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> between cells that are not directly   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controlled by the genome. But the source of   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the bits that interact is still the genome,   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> at first the maternal genome and later the   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> zygote's.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Certainly all proteins in the cell are   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> produced from gene coding. However, doesn't   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the following (for example) demonstrate that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the cytoplasm is in control and telling the   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DNA what to do (so to speak):   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "It is concluded that whenever nuclei are   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> introduced experimentally into the cytoplasm   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of another cell, they very quickly assume, in   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nearly every respect, the nuclear activity   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> characteristic of the host cell. In many   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instances, altered function has been   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> demonstrated in nuclei which subsequently   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support normal development." [1]   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sure, that's because various transcription   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> factors and such are in the cytoplasm, having   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been transcribed and translated from the   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> previous nucleus. Differences between genomes   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> result in differences in expression.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Here's the critical logic: if the direction of   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> control flow is bi- directional, then to   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resolve a chicken- and- egg paradox, we must   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> conclude that information is initially present   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in both the nucleus and extra- nuclear, in   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> effectively digital and analogue form   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> respectively.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Digital" and "analog" are empty buzzwords in   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this context. But yes, proteins contain   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> information, if that's what you mean. But that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> information is inherited, over the long term,   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the form of DNA.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On what basis do you deem these "empty buzzwords"?   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A digital information medium stores heritable   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> information in discrete symbolic sequences that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are copied and decoded by rule- based molecular   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> machinery. The human genome at 3.2 billion base   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
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